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Welcome to the wiki. :) If you want an extension installed you have to ask [[User:JoePlay|JoePlay]]. He is a wiki.com staff member. [[User:Polexian|<span style="color:#ffAA22; cursor:help" title="Polexian is a Dragon Age: Origins Wiki Nobody"><span style="font: 24pt brush script mt;color:#6C2DC7">Polexian</span>]][[User_talk:Polexian|<span style="color:#ffAA22; cursor:help" title="View My Talk Page"><sup><span style="font: 12pt brush script mt;color:#800517"> ''♦♦Talk♦♦''</span></sup>]][http://dragonage.wikia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Polexian&action=edit&section=new<sup><span style="color:#ffAA22; cursor:help" title="Leave Message on my talk page"><span style="font: 12pt brush script mt;color:SlateBlue"> ''♠♠Leave Message♠♠'']</span></span></sup> 02:35, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
 
Welcome to the wiki. :) If you want an extension installed you have to ask [[User:JoePlay|JoePlay]]. He is a wiki.com staff member. [[User:Polexian|<span style="color:#ffAA22; cursor:help" title="Polexian is a Dragon Age: Origins Wiki Nobody"><span style="font: 24pt brush script mt;color:#6C2DC7">Polexian</span>]][[User_talk:Polexian|<span style="color:#ffAA22; cursor:help" title="View My Talk Page"><sup><span style="font: 12pt brush script mt;color:#800517"> ''♦♦Talk♦♦''</span></sup>]][http://dragonage.wikia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Polexian&action=edit&section=new<sup><span style="color:#ffAA22; cursor:help" title="Leave Message on my talk page"><span style="font: 12pt brush script mt;color:SlateBlue"> ''♠♠Leave Message♠♠'']</span></span></sup> 02:35, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
 
:Sweet, thanks for that. [[User:Jmjimmy|Jmjimmy]] 03:36, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
 
:Sweet, thanks for that. [[User:Jmjimmy|Jmjimmy]] 03:36, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
  +
::ArrayExtension is now installed. [[User:JoePlay|<b>JoePlay</b>]]<staff /> ([[User talk:JoePlay|<font size="1">talk</font>]]) 18:48, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

Revision as of 18:48, February 12, 2010

Wiki

Welcome!

Hi, welcome to the Dragon Age Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the Forum:Can't open locked chests as mage!! page.

I hope that you will stick around and continue to help us improve the wiki.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- Tierrie (Talk) 00:05, 20 January 2010

Mad Hermit

Hi Jmjimmy,

Would you be so kind to explain why did you trash the entire walkthrough and more of the Mad Hermit page? There's no mention of the edit on the discussion page and I feel that the text was quite acurate, comprehensive and helpful. Did you do it on purpose or it was just a mistake? Veshialle 07:34, February 10, 2010 (UTC)


Never mind. Someone pointed me out that the notes are still there under the spoiller banner. What's weird is that I don't remember ever before having to click on the banner to read such notes. BTW, sorry if I wrote this on the wrong place. I've been visiting the Wiki for over a month, but I just created an account and I am still getting familiar with the process. Thank you! Veshialle 08:01, February 10, 2010 (UTC)

No worries! The old spoiler warnings are being replaced by
{{SpoilerDAO}}
so that people can still glance through a page without worrying that they'll read a spoiler (or click any one and they all reveal the text until you choose to hide it again). Jmjimmy 05:12, February 11, 2010 (UTC)

Conversation Options

I noticed you are adding Conversation Options, I did a simplified version of what you done Here. You maybe interested with it, to make it look a little cleaner (or another way if you like), so we don't get a clean up tags on the articles. This is just an fyi, in hopes of assisting you and the respective articles.  Hollowness | Talk | Contr 18:52, January 24, 2010 (UTC)

Hey Hollowness, thanks for that. I'm not sure if that will work for the more extensive conversations but it definitely is cleaner. I think I'd like to get them in first and clean them up after. (ie: hopefully the "crowd" can give me a hand :) Jmjimmy 19:45, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Actually better yet now that the articles are being over run by dialogue, it is better to move them to Morrigan's Dialogue, Alistair's Dialogue etc. It is far more appropriate there.  Hollowness | Talk | Contr 19:59, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I was thinking about that option. It doesn't quite fit there as well since those are passive conversations. The other problem is that there would be a lot of description that would need to be added as to when and where these conversations can be had. This is why I thought of putting them in the corresponding location. If you have a better idea, even splitting each section of dialogue off and simply linking to it from the location's walkthrough section maybe? Jmjimmy 20:04, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
The article is named 'dialogue' not 'passive dialigue', just no one has added Companion and Warden Dialogue till now. I moved it accordingly (double check make sure I didn't miss any), see if it satisfies you, if you plan to go the distance with all dialogue options, I recommend make these pages your new home.  Hollowness | Talk | Contr 20:19, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Oh, and if you want to, you can link the Dialogue on the respected pages (Ostagar, Deep in the Wilds, Lothering) to the Dialogue article if applicable, so people know its available.  Hollowness | Talk | Contr 20:25, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
I just wanted to let you know what a GREAT job you are doing, this is a major task (I was planning on taking up, if no one else did but you did so OMG thanks :D). I know that you are putting a lot of time and effort into this project and I'd like to give you props and if I can help or assist you out in anyway let me know. Have a great day :D  Hollowness | Talk | Contr 20:06, January 26, 2010 (UTC)
No problem, I'm just documenting what info I can find, there's still a lot missing (like Wynne, Zevran, non-Human Noble specifics, and the triggers for Sten's further conversations) Jmjimmy 21:40, January 26, 2010 (UTC)

Alistair's Dialogue

First, I wanted to say a big THANK YOU for taking on the task of recording all the significant (in terms of approval change) coversation options in a game with a very complex dialogue tree. I'd like to help you, but before I myself make any changes/additions, I first need to record the exacting wording and approval changes for some specific conversations. Even before that however, I had some questions on the format you wanted to use for some specific situations. How do you want to indicate if a dialogue choice depends on a choice made in a previous, but seperate, conversation? For example, when you first meet Alistair you have the option of asking him about his tiff with the mage. If you *don't*, you have the chance for further approval gain/loss in subsequent conversations before entering the Wilds. Specifically, if you select "Tell me about yourself.", you get a very different response than if you had previously asked him about the mage - he quizzes you about your background first, specifically asking if you wanted to join the Grey Wardens. This leads to a gamut of choices that can raise, lower, or not affect his approval. Do you want to just indicate this with a parenthetical statement such as:

  • Tell me about yourself. (And you did not ask about argument w/ mage in earlier conversation)
    • Choice one. (+ Approval)
    • Choice two. (- Approval)
    • etc.

?

Then there's also the question of how to approach conversations where the character (in this case Alistair) is not the one you initiated conversation with. For example, while going over the plans for the Tower of Ishal with Duncan, you have the option of selecting something like "I agree with Alistair." which nets you a +1 approval bump. Do you just want to exclude them? Or perhaps include them as if they were initiated with the character in question? After all, there are group conversations like this were each party member has significant talk time.

A few other notes:

  • Deep in the Wilds: In all my games so far, I have gotten +4 approval from *both* Alistair and Morrigan, so while there may be some dialog options that conflict, it is certainly possible to get approval from both characters at this juncture.
  • Lothering: You don't *need* to give the Small Carved Statuette in order to get these conversation topics - it seems to depend more on approval rating in general.
  • Camp: Again, I think this conversation merely checks on approval rating, and the people he asks about depend on who is in the camp at the time. I *know* he can ask about Zevran. He doesn't seem to ever ask about Shale/Dog/Wynn. I don't know about Oghren.



I probably won't be making any additions/corrections until I hear back from you. Thanks again!

Nebuchadrezzar 16:06, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

Hey Nebuchadrezzar, thanks for the note - feel free to edit as you wish. The format I chose was to only specify the optimal route through the conversation. There are many iterations and complexities that can't be covered in this format. There is a guide that I used when first going through the game that covers many (but not all) of these in more detail so I wasn't going to duplicate it, more use the knowledge I gained from it (along with a couple corrections) to create a simple walkthrough. As you pointed out, approval rating is what is important to trigger certain conversations - but rather than use specific numbers (which are hard to determine on consoles) I added the simplest way to gain the extra approval needed to get to the needed approval rating.

I handled dialogue loops in one of two ways: where order was important (ie: one set of dialogue opened up another) I simply continued the indent so the tree flows. Where the dialogue simply ends and loops back to an earlier dialogue set I would indent the same as the original dialogue.

Example:

1. x leads to A which opens up z 2. y 3. z (doesn't appear until conversation A has been had)

  • x
    • A
      • z
  • y

If you have corrections or improvements please feel free to add them. I'll paste a copy of the original guide I used in your talk page. Jmjimmy 17:00, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

Shale's Dialogue

Voxon e 19:48, January 26, 2010 (UTC)

I'll admit that my format was a bit complicated. It was an attempt (a poor one, apparently) to better show options and causality in the dialogue choices. Dialogue choices boil down to two types, XOR type, where only one option can be picked, and OR type, where you can choose more than one option from the list. Knowing that, I arranged the conversation options like this.

For the XOR type decision

(Option 1) || (Option 2) || (Option 3)

The next dialogue option was indented

  • (XOR Option 1) || (XOR Option 2) || (XOR Option 3)
    • (Next Option 1) || (Next Option 2) || (Next Option 3)


For the OR type decision, choices were indented to the same level.

  • (OR Option 1)
  • (OR Option 2)

An OR choice that led to a new dialogue option would be shown as

  • (OR Option 1)
    • (Next Option 1)
  • (OR Option 2

With this format you can combine the XOR and OR conversations

  • (OR Option 1)
    • (Next Option 1)
  • (XOR Option 2) || (XOR Option 3)
    • (Next Option 2)

This would mean that by choosing Option 1 the next choices displayed would be Next Option 1, XOR Option 2, XOR Option 3 If XOR Option 2 or XOR Option 3 were picked first, then OR Option 1 would be lost, and the conversation would proceed to Next Option 2

Here's an example of a combination XOR/OR options for Shale's Dialogue

  • 1. How did you end up in Honnleath? Do you remember?
    • 1.2 I though you would have enjoyed hurting humans.
    • 1.3 But why were you out in front the tower
      • 1.3.1 His wife?
        • 1.3.1.1 How does one shrink a golem?
    • 1.4 You don't like this Wilheim, I take it
      • 1.4.1 Not really. It was quite a bargain. || Wilheim's wife sold it, I believe. || Oh, yes. A fortune in fact.
    • 1.5 Do you remember anything before Honnleath?
      • 1.5.1 Just how old are you exactly?
    • 1.6 Interesting. I'm done asking about that.

1.x are all OR options so choosing one of these has no effect on being able to choose any of the other options. However, in 1.4.1 only one of the three choices can be picked before the conversation goes back to the 1.x level.

Shale's dialogue tree is very simple when compared to Alistairs or Morrigans. But using this format, with some explanations when needed, I think it would be possible to map out complete conversation trees regardless of complexity.

I found it very confusing to read and couldn't make sense of half of it. There's also the problem of looping dialogue which doesn't get taken into account. Cases where you can follow different dialogue trees and it loops back to different points along the tree.
I updated Shale's dialogue again to be more complete and appear more as it would in game (numbered). I think it makes it a little clearer. I included arrows as to which dialogue options are best to choose and numbered some where the order was important. There are some "Conditional appearance" options that I'm not sure what the specific condition is but based on the guide (see previous talk) the conditions do exsist (note: I wasn't sure where the Race specific dialogue you added fit in - everything I have is based on Human Noble)
I think the reality is that the "[GoTo X] method in the guide is the best for completeness and a show/hide tree mechanism would be ideal but a lot of work to implement.




I haven't left any commentary on the Zevran Aranai page. As a matter of fact, I was deleting someone else's commentary. I found that their "Oops" is not needed any more than my commentary from two days ago. If you insist on changing it and adding it back then explain why, please.

Hey, sorry about that, it seems the email coming from Wikia seems to be quite delayed, the compare page I received showed the oops being added back in as the last change - I was attempting to remove it as well. I reworded and formatted it - the oops is gone :) Jmjimmy 19:30, February 7, 2010 (UTC)

Template Void

The usage of ns:0 is indeed useful in the case of a template void - inclusion of a template OR null - so that it doesn't bug out on an EOF. The case in question here is a variable, not a template. Syntactically the difference is between 2 curly braces indicating a template, and 3 curly braces, indicating a variable. This should clarify it. -- tierrie talk contr 09:06, February 8, 2010 (UTC)

Category: Vendor Trash

Hi, I noticed you added the category Vendor Trash to a bunch of items. I feel like the name of this category was somewhat subjective and arbitary. I'd like to suggest asking in the forums for some suggestions before creating a category. However, I like that you were trying to do some cleanup in that sense and would like to encourage you to keep it up. Cheers! -- tierrie talk contr 20:08, February 8, 2010 (UTC)

Heh, I was thinking the same thing this morning - a simple change might be "Junk" since that's what the game uses Jmjimmy 20:31, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
!User:Tierrie PS: I think you maybe under the mistaken impression that I created the "Vendor Trash" category - I merely added a couple items to an existing category. Jmjimmy 20:59, February 8, 2010 (UTC)
@Jmjimmy, mea culpa. I apologize for the assumption. And bee tea dub, Junkn would make a lot more sense to me.-- tierrie talk contr 21:05, February 8, 2010 (UTC)

Vandal

Thanks for the heads up about the vandal the other day. Unfortunately I wasn't around to do anything on the spot, but I have now checked the contributions of the user in question and it seems their vandalism was limited to the Zevran example you spotted. It always pays to be safe though. Zoev talk 18:45, February 10, 2010 (UTC)

Since this is up your alley

Forum:Approval, it looks like admins' want a new approval/disapproval templates, it is being discussed in the forums. I thought you like to give your input on this since you work with approval/disapproval so much :D  Hollowness | Talk | Contr 06:35, February 11, 2010 (UTC)

Install Extensions..

Welcome to the wiki. :) If you want an extension installed you have to ask JoePlay. He is a wiki.com staff member. Polexian ♦♦Talk♦♦ ♠♠Leave Message♠♠ 02:35, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

Sweet, thanks for that. Jmjimmy 03:36, February 12, 2010 (UTC)
ArrayExtension is now installed. JoePlay@fandom (talk) 18:48, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

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