“The Landsmeet's the big news. Every dusty noble estate in Denerim is airing its sheets, waiting for the lord to ride into town.” ―Gorim
The Landsmeet is a major quest in Dragon Age: Origins. Here, the Warden has the opportunity to influence who will rule Ferelden.
Walkthrough
Arl Eamon
The Landsmeet is proposed by Arl Eamon of Redcliffe as a way to deal with Loghain's treachery, by putting him up against a vote of his peers. Once the Warden has gathered all armies with the Grey Warden treaties, Eamon will call for the Landsmeet to convene, and brings the Warden, Alistair, and their companions to his estate in Denerim.
- See Arl Eamon's Estate for the map and details about the area.
Upon arriving in Denerim for the Landsmeet, you are informed by Queen Anora's handmaiden Erlina that the Queen is being held captive by Rendon Howe at his estate in Denerim. She requests your assistance in freeing her. You'll need to sneak into Howe's estate to rescue Anora.
Rescue the Queen
- Main article: Rescue the Queen
- See Arl of Denerim's Estate for the map(s) and details about the area(s).
Anora
This Estate is far more than just the place where Anora is held captive. It is, in fact, the only place to gain supporters against Loghain (outside of the Alienage) and is, therefore, the only thing that will ensure you win the Landsmeet. Your chances of winning the Landsmeet are begun in positive and negative support from the minute you arrive in Denerim and how you structure your quest to Arl Eamon's request to look around and see if you can garner support. The first place you need to go is Arl Howe's Estate.
You have to sneak into the Arl's estate by procuring guard uniforms (which you will be automatically changed into once you have them). You cannot have Shale in your active party during this quest. If you do, before you move to sneaking into the Estate, Anora's handmaiden will request Shale be replaced.
Inside, you are free to explore as much as you like, and nobody will question you as long as you keep the uniforms on. Once you reach Anora's door, you will find that a mage has put up a force field on the door. You need to find the mage, who Anora says will likely be with Arl Howe, to disengage the force field. Keep going down the hall. If you have not finished exploring the area, if you enter the first room in the last hallway do not go too far into the room (though it is possible to go far enough into the room to gather codex), you simply need to allow him to get to a point in the conversation with his female companion that she begins talking at which point he will be sufficiently distracted enough to allow you this far, but do not go any closer to him because unlike the other guards, this one will not ignore you completely. He will realize you are not part of the regiment, and will sound an alarm. This will cause all the guards in the estate to turn hostile. It is possible if you do not care for the Codex entry, to simply not open this door and continue onward.
As you approach the dungeons, you will encounter Riordan, another Grey Warden who will become key to the plot further on. He is also the person you will need to talk to in order to find Duncan's Shield. You need to ensure you get the 'Grey Warden Papers' from the chest in the room before you enter the cellar. These are the papers on the joining ritual and Riordan may need them later.
The Dungeons
- See Arl of Denerim's Estate - Dungeon for the map and details about the area.
In the dungeon, your disguises will be useless as Howe's men will know you are not one of them and will attack you. Watch out for the grease trap at the beginning, as the tripwire is tricky to disarm.
There are a number of prisoners you can free (though two may not be present depending on actions taken in the City Elf Origin), some of which are relatives of nobility. They are:
- Oswyn, son of Bann Sighard, is tied to a rack in a torture chamber. Freeing him starts the quest Tortured Noble.
- Rexel, the missing soldier for the Chanter's Board quest Missing in Action, is in one of the jail cells on the east side.
- Across from Rexel at the end is Soris, an elf from the alienage. Releasing him makes Shianni more receptive to you in a later quest (and nets you +4 approval with Zevran). He will not be here if a City Elf Warden took all responsibility for the incident during the origin story.
- Vaughan, the son of the former arl of Denerim, is found in a cell on the north side. You can also release him for aid in the Landsmeet. If you tell him that your rescue will be very costly, he will give you a key to a chest containing 40 sovereigns. With enough Coercion, you can trick him into giving you the key and leaving him to rot. You can also simply kill him (though you won't be able to loot the key from his body). Needless to say, he won't be here if he was killed during the City Elf Origin, but he will be there at the Landsmeet.
- Next to Vaughan's cell is Irminric, a delirious templar. Unlike Rexel, he will not leave his cell, instead asking you to give his sister Bann Alfstanna his ring. This starts the quest Lost Templar.
Howe himself is found in a dungeon room with two mages, one of whom can shapeshift. He will attack you after some dialogue. Be advised that Howe can use stealth and mark of death. Once he is dead, you can loot the Biteback Axe from him.
Vaughan
Vaughan is a possible individual for release in the dungeons (unless you are playing as a City Elf and killed him). There is a possible bug that can occur when you approach Vaughan's cell (as an individual other than a City Elf) which will cause Vaughan to be behaving as though he's awake, but if you attempt to speak to him, all you'll get it snoring. You're also incapable of opening Vaughan's cell as usual. Meaning you are unable to garner his family's support in the Landsmeet. It is advisable to save before fighting Howe and to load your save if you get this glitch. The loaded file should be bug-free. You can also try clicking the cell door to trigger dialog with him instead of talking to him directly. If that fails you can take the door to the first floor, and then go back into the dungeon. If leaving and coming back fails to make him respond properly it is also possible to stand near Vaughan with the cell door targeted then have a mage cast glyph of paralysis followed by glyph of repulsion on top of him, this will cause an explosion that paralyzes you both and once the spell ends interacting with the cell door starts the dialogue. Acid Flasks and the Fireball spell work as well. At this point he will react as normal. Note also that if you do release Vaughan, you will net -4 or -5 approval from Zevran, and +2 approval from Morrigan.
Vaughn will offer you the key to his lockbox containing 40 sovereigns in exchange for his freedom. You can persuade him to hand you the key first and choose to leave him in the dungeon, or kill him for his crimes after. Vaughan can be also released in exchange for his support in the Landsmeet regardless of whether or not he rewarded the Warden.
It is very possible to win the Landsmeet vote without his support.
Ser Cauthrien
When you are done in here, return upstairs to Anora's room. (Note: as long as you do not unlock the door, the guards right outside cannot enter. Thus, you can cast as many AOE spells as you like outside of the room, allowing you easy kills with no chance of getting hurt in return.) As you make your way to the front door, you will be accosted by Ser Cauthrien and a large number of Loghain's guards. You can either surrender, put up a fight, or tell her that you are trying to rescue the queen. If you reveal the queen's presence, she will accuse the party of kidnapping her. Either way, it will trigger a fight with Cauthrien and her men. She is very difficult to defeat; if everyone falls or you surrender, the Warden along with Alistair (if he is with you) will be taken to Fort Drakon which starts the quest, Captured!. (your other companions will retreat to Eamon's estate)
Battle with Ser Cauthrien and Loghain's Guards
Note : (Some people may struggle with winning this battle. Remember that you can reset the difficulty to casual.)
- See Ser Cauthrien For more advanced tactics how to defeat her.
If you're determined to go through with this fight, pull back as soon as you can into a corridor or room to force the archers to chase you down, gather together and provide an easier target for mass crowd control. If you retreat fast enough and far enough back into the corridor you came from and into the first room on the right (further down the hall and opposite the side from Anora's cell), it is possible to lure Ser Cauthrien by herself into the room, where she can be handled with ease. Her remaining guards are much easier to deal with once she is out of the way, and they can be taken care of at your leisure. (Guards may open the door and follow her in as well, verified on PC version, and there is a 50-50 chance that they will on the 360). Should you manage to beat Ser Cauthrien and Loghain's guards, loot the Summer Sword from Ser Cauthrien, a very nice two handed sword. If you try to fight Ser Cauthrien and Loghain's guards head on, you will find it extremely difficult even if you have a powerful tank such as an Arcane Warrior or a high level Sword-and-Shield user. In this case, you must use one of your allies to distract Loghain's guards and try to kill the mage as soon as possible. If you have a templar, then it is a good idea to use him for this act. Another extremely effective way to accomplish this is to use the Sleep spell, which can put the entirety of Ser Cauthrien's guard under if placed correctly. The rest should take on Ser Cauthrien, as she can deal more damage than all the guard combined. It is entirely possible that by the time Ser Cauthrien is dead, you will be the sole survivor. However, if you managed to take out the mage, then it should be easy from that point.
Another way is to engage Ser Cauthrien and retreat to the room where the queen was held. Once Ser Cauthrien in the room, close the door and deal with her. Other enemies usually wait outside the door. If you have a mage in your party, then using cold and shock clouds from inside the room (without opening the door) will dispatch all remaining enemy units with no trouble.
It should also be noted that surrendering or losing the fight with Ser Cauthrien is not the last opportunity to obtain the Summer Sword; she will again attempt to stop you just before you enter the Landsmeet Chamber (see below).
Regardless of how well you prepare, procure evidence, and how convincing an argument you give during the Landsmeet, one of the nobles will always side with Loghain, and another will always side with the Wardens, leaving four more nobles to decide the result of the Landsmeet.
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Bug! If you manage to kill Ser Cauthrien here and collect the Summer Sword from her body, yet still "die" during the fight, then Ser Cauthrien will still confront the Warden outside the Landsmeet. This will produce two Summer Swords. |
Captured!
- Main article: Captured!
If the Warden surrenders to or is defeated by Ser Cauthrien, then s/he will be taken to Fort Drakon and the Captured! quest will start. If Alistair was in the party, then he will be imprisoned along with the Warden. Anora and the rest of the companions will return to Arl Eamon's estate and tell him what happened. After waking up in Fort Drakon, The Warden has the option of either breaking out or waiting for rescue by friendly companions. Once free of the prison, it will be time to speak with Arl Eamon and Anora. Note that if you are captured, your equipment will be removed; these items can be retrieved from a chest just to the right of the door leading out of the cells.
Back at Arl Eamon's Estate
Once the queen has been rescued and the Warden is at liberty, there is the chance to make good on getting people to side with the Warden against Loghain. Everyone who had a son/brother imprisoned can be found at the Gnawed Noble Tavern. Give Alfstanna the ring if you want her support; if you do not give her the ring, you will lose her support at the Landsmeet. Don't forget to approach Arl Wulff in the booth closest to the door in the Gnawed Noble Tavern and talk to him to ensure you secure his vote. There are several individuals who will have their say at the Landsmeet. One of them will always vote for Loghain, so you need to procure the support of the others.
After returning to Arl Eamon's Estate, Anora will explain that there has been unrest in The Denerim Alienage and that she suspects her father and Arl Howe are behind it. She suggests investigating the Alienage for incriminating evidence to use against Loghain at the Landsmeet.
At this point, it is also possible to lay some groundwork for who will take the throne by speaking with Anora and Alistair. It is possible to convince Alistair to marry Anora with sufficient Coercion skill.
Riordan will also be in Arl Eamon's estate. If the Warden Documents were found in the Arl of Denerim's estate, then speaking with him now gives the Warden the option to ask more about the Grey Warden Vault he mentioned, and he will explain its location.
Unrest in the Alienage
Shianni explains what's causing unrest in the Alienage
- Main article: Unrest in the Alienage
Once this quest has been obtained from Anora, the previously closed gate to the Alienage from the Denerim Market District is now open and can be used to access the Alienage via the Denerim City Map (the guard by the gate will confirm that the Alienage is now open again). You will not be able to reach the Alienage directly from your map and instead must go through the exit in the southeastern portion of the Market District.
Inside the Alienage, there seems to be some sort of plague, and some Tevinter mages allege that they are helping to cure it. Shianni, however, is suspicious of their motives. Investigate the Tevinters and reveal Loghain and Howe's implication in elven slavery (see main article for walkthrough).
At the end of the Tevinter Warehouse you will encounter a large battle with a blood mage and a bunch of his minions. Upon defeating him he will offer to increase your HP (however he must kill the elve prisoners) in exchange for his life. Accepting his offer will cost you a -40 approval hit from Wynne, a -10 from Alistair, and -15 from Leliana. Morrigan will support you about the Mage's offer.
After completing the quest, head back to Arl Eamon's estate and show him the Slave Papers. You have to do this if you plan to use Loghain selling elves to slavers as evidence in the Landsmeet. If you do not show the papers to Eamon, this will be considered a false unsupported claim and will work against you.
Royal Palace
After completing the last quest, a new icon appears on the Denerim City Map and you can travel to the Royal Palace where the Landsmeet is held. Traveling there starts the next part of this quest line. And so the Landsmeet starts.
The Landsmeet Decision
If you didn't wipe out Ser Cauthrien's troops at the Arl of Denerim's estate (just killing her there but dying to the guards is not sufficient, even if you loot her corpse), she will attempt to block your entrance to the Landsmeet. You have several conversation options here with Ser Cauthrien which makes a second fight completely avoidable. If your persuasion skill is high enough she will even admit to knowing that Loghain must be stopped and she will allow you by without incident. Killing her is difficult but nets you The Summer Sword; this encounter will still be easier than at the Arl of Denerim's Estate.
Depending on your decisions in The Landsmeet, you may lose any items Alistair has equipped. Accordingly, it is highly recommended that you remove all of his weapons, armor, etc.|
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Bug! The Persuade option actually checks against Poison Making, instead of the Coercion skill, but you can convince Ser Cauthrien to stand down. The Intimidate option makes the right check, but you must make another Intimidate or Persuade check after that to convince Cauthrien that Loghain is wrong. |
The decision is basically a popularity contest and you need five "points" to win the Landsmeet. However, the point system has little to do with the voting as presented in the cutscene and the player may arrive at a confusing result of seemingly winning the vote, yet losing the debate.
Support:
- Anora's support = 3
- The Grand Cleric's denunciation = 2
- Each named noble who supports you (via successful quest and/or argument) = 1
- Each named noble who supports Loghain (via failed quest and/or argument) = -1
- Persuasive argument = 1
- Failed argument = -1
You can gain the support as follows (the nobles are listed in the same order as they vote in the final cutscene):
- doesn’t vote herself but speaks at the end of the debate against Loghain, if you talked to her prior the Landsmeet, promised to support her claim for the throne and didn’t insist that Loghain must pay for his crimes. Not meeting these conditions results in her speaking against the Warden. The Warden's reply to the accusation of kidnapping Anora does not affect anything.
- Grand Cleric (optional)
- doesn’t vote herself but denounces Loghain if the Lost Templar is completed and the charge of poisoning Arl Eamon is brought up in the third round of the debate
- Bann Vaughan Kendalls of Denerim (optional)
- you can release him from Howe’s prison in exchange for his vote
- Arl Bryland of the South Reach
- votes for the Warden by default and doesn’t count to the support (outbalanced by Ceorlic)
Bann Alfstanna
- Bann Alfstanna of the Waking Seas
- votes for the Warden on the basis of:
- quest – completing The Lost Templar by giving Alfstanna her brother’s ring at the Gnawed Noble Tavern prior the Landsmeet
- argument – passing the persuade check either with “Blight is the threat here, not Orlais” or with supporting Alistair’s claim in the third round of argumentation.
- Bann Sighard of Dragon’s Peak
- votes for the Warden on the basis of:
- quest – completing the Tortured Noble by releasing Sighard’s son from Howe’s prison
- argument – bringing up the slavery charge
- Arl Wulff of the Western Hills
- votes for the Warden on the basis of:
- argument – saying that Blight is the real threat either in the first or the third round of argumentation, regardless of the persuade check
- votes against the Warden by default and doesn’t count (outbalanced by Bryland)
- nobleman associated with Crows (optional)
- votes for the Warden on the basis of:
- quest – completing the Trial of the Crows
- the last noble
- does not count as support but summarizes the general outcome of the Landsmeet (his vote and the outcome of the debate never differ)
Optional points are those which only the Warden can collect; if he fails to do so, the persons remain silent and do not side with Loghain.
There are multiple ways how to win the Landsmeet. Completing the quests and securing Anora’s support allows for a great variability of the debate. You should only be careful when presenting the arguments of Ostagar or Alistair’s claim to the throne, as they aren’t backed by any evidence and without the successful persuade checks will cost you points. Any argumentative chain starting with Alistair’s claim in the first round and continuing with accusing Loghain of committing treason at Ostagar in the second round (neither has a persuade check available) leads to losing the debate, no matter how many support points you have garnered.
Winning without Anora:
If you cannot rely on Anora’s support, you have to secure as many votes prior the Landsmeet as possible, meaning you have to complete the quests and either release Vaughan and/or do the Trial of the Crows. You then have to bring up the strongest available argument in each round, i.e. Blight in the first round, Howe’s crimes in the second and poisoning Eamon in the third one.
Winning without completing quests:
You cannot bring up the arguments of Howe and Eamon since you do not have any proof. You need Anora’s support and persuasive arguments which do not cost you any points, which is Blight in the first round, slavery in the second and Alistair’s claim (with a successful persuade check) in the third.
Losing:
If you have not completed enough actions to gain the support of the majority of the nobles, you lose the debate. If this happens, Loghain will order you arrested, with Arl Eamon declaring he will fight back. An all-out brawl will break out in the Landsmeet chamber.
Alternately, tell Loghain "if it's a fight you want, you'll get it! (Attack)"
Winning:
If you win the Landsmeet, Loghain will accuse everyone of being traitors and refuse to give up power, and you can either directly challenge him to an honorable duel or outright attack.
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Bug! On XBox 360, if you skip through the dialog too quickly the game will leave you and Loghain staring at each other with no dialog option, leaving you no choice but to reset the console! |
Brawl:
Arl Eamon and his men will back you up; Anora's royal guards will also help you against Loghain, but only if you have supported her for succession to the throne. Other named nobles fight on the side of whomever they support. After you deplete Loghain's health, the Revered Mother and nobles will break up the fight, and suggest that the matter be settled with a one-on-one duel.
Duel:
Once it's time to settle matters with a duel, you have to decide if you, Alistair, or one of your companions will fight him (except Dog; choosing the mabari as your champion nets some amusing dialogue). If you keep refusing the duelling option, Alistair will finally lose his patience and duel Loghain himself.
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Bug! If you choose your Dog, your PC will duel Loghain regardless if you chose another companion. |
Loghain fights with a sword and shield, and may switch to a crossbow if you move out of range. He can knock you down with Shield Bash or War Cry, so use some caution if you don't have good physical resistance. A mage can easily defeat him with Cone of Cold, which renders him largely unable to fight back. Using an Arcane Warrior or even a plain mage can prove this battle very easy. Loghain is not immune to Crushing Prison spell, which can take him out in less than 10 seconds in combination with good attacks. Glyph of Repulsion, centered on a mage, also works surprisingly well to keep Loghain from effectively attacking. If you want to use more mundane tactics, Loghain is hard to hit, but you can even out the playing field immensely with some Soldier's Bane. It keeps his special attacks to a minimum. A warrior can simply outlast him in a battle of attrition, since he doesn't drink potions.
When you win the duel, Loghain will surrender. Unless Alistair was chosen for the duel, Riordan will appear and you will be given the chance to show Loghain mercy and induct him into the Grey Wardens. You can only have him undertake the Joining if Anora is supported as queen, or you have Anora and Alistair marry, provided Alistair is not the one who killed Loghain; if Alistair is supported he will order Loghain's death. Alternatively, you can choose to kill Loghain yourself, or let Alistair kill him (he does this automatically if he was selected for the duel). If you previously convinced Anora and Alistair to marry, but then choose Alistair to duel Loghain, Alistair will automatically kill him and Anora will refuse to marry Alistair, leaving the Warden to choose between the two. This decision has consequences that can greatly alter the story.
Result
- Main article: Possible Landsmeet Outcomes
There are a vast number of possibilities and outcomes for the main characters after Loghain has been defeated in the duel. Some of these choices and options will only be available to characters with a high Coercion rank, or by laying groundwork for them in prior events. Depending on the choices made during the dialogue, deciding the fates of these characters can be a tangled affair, with one decision having significant consequences on the fate of the others.
- Additionally if you succeed at the Landsmeet you will be awarded with +1 spell/talent and +1 attribute point (attribute is not given in PC version). This will show as a level up, but will not increase your level.
Alistair
Alistair might:
- Rule on his own
- Rule jointly with Anora
- Rule jointly with a female Human Noble Warden as his queen-consort
- Remain as a Grey Warden and let Anora rule
- Be executed by Anora
- Leave the party and become a wandering drunk
Anora
Anora might:
- Rule on her own
- Rule jointly with Alistair
- Rule jointly with a male Human Noble Warden as her king-consort provided that you have not "hardened" Alistair
- Be imprisoned by Alistair, if he becomes king and doesn't marry Anora
Note: Anora will refuse to marry her father's murderer, so if you are planning for either the male Human Noble or Alistair to rule with her, you must make the other individual perform the deed.
Loghain
Loghain might be:
- Executed by Alistair, the Warden, or one of the remaining two party members
- Recruited into the Grey Wardens (causing Alistair to leave the party for good)
Trivia
- When you first talk to Anora after opening her door, one of the conversation options is "Aren't you a little short for a guard?" this is most likely a reference to Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope in which Princess Leia asks Luke upon him rescuing her: "Aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper?"
- In one of the top-angle scenes from the Landsmeet hall, there can be seen a black bird perched on the ceiling beam.
- Anyone who has played through Chapter 2 of Neverwinter Nights 2 will see the similarity between The Landmeet and the player character's murder trial in that game. Firstly, in both games you can sway the audience with enough diplomacy/coercion. Secondly, if it goes bad for you, you will call for a duel which will decide the outcome, much like Sand does in NWN2. If it goes well for you, then Loghain will call for a duel, like Torio does in NWN2. Before the trial in NWN2 you can gather evidence supporting your innocence, much like the Warden's gathering of evidence of Loghain's wrongdoing.
- Something similar also occurs in Jade Empire. The PC has the option of presiding over a "debate" in which the PC tries to convince the foreign "barbarian" that the native peoples & culture of Jade Empire is sophisticated and adequate in its own right. This event too, ends in a duel between the PC & the argumentative foreigner.