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New title[edit source]

Usually the PC ingame has a name they are usually referred to as such (i.e grey warden recruit, or the lone wanderer from f3) so I am thinking I will move this page to a new title when we find out (probably when we acquire the game). --Selty 06:51, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Screenshots[edit source]

Also, just a heads up when we get some PC creation film and/or screens, I will be putting it up. --Selty 04:20, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

There are some more high-res screenshots on this German site if you're interested. Some close-ups, nothing spectacular, I guess. MyNickIsTakenSoIUseThisOne 21:13, 10 August 2009 (UTC) -- Alexander

Haha. You didn't bother to look at the article, did you, Alex? :)
-- Xavier Grimwand on Monday, August 10, 2009 @ 9:35 pm (ET)

Huh? Do you mean the Russian pictures? That's why I wrote "some more", not so much but at least a bit different. Was just a suggestion. Other than that, I probably missed the point, yup. ^^ MyNickIsTakenSoIUseThisOne 17:06, 11 August 2009 (UTC) -- Alexander

Gender[edit source]

I heard somewhere (think it might have been early press releases) that the PC would be male only. Seeing it listed here as unisex I was just wondering if new info had arisen? RabidStoat 16:43, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

You might be thinking of a different game. Dragon Age has never restricted gender, that I am aware of. Regardless, all players may freely choose their character's gender on the generation screen.
-- Xavier Grimwand on Thursday, July 9, 2009 @ 6:05 pm (ET)

Rank[edit source]

If there are questions, please discuss on this talk page, not in the summary. MyNickIsTakenSoIUseThisOne 23:41, 24 August 2009 (UTC) -- Alexander

I deleted it for a reason; rank is not something that the PC has, and should not be featured in the PC page. NPC page, yes, along with some more information perhaps (if available), but the player character will NOT have a "rank". EDIT: Ah, sorry, just wasn't sure if you understood. No offense meant. Marik333 23:46, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Cool, my last entry on this talk page hasn't been saved because you were writing at the same time. Didn't notice. Thanks for your correction. I also found Mary's post contradicting with Georg's explanation about the rank, so I reverted my last entry. I assumed Georg writing that there is something called RANK_PLAYER, was obvious. Seems I was wrong. MyNickIsTakenSoIUseThisOne 00:24, 25 August 2009 (UTC) -- Alexander

Clarification is up, by DavidSims. The PC has a rank but it's basically considered fix. So it's all good with Marik's suggestion to move it to the NPCs. Sorry if I sounded hostile - didn't intended to. I just had the opinion that clarification was needed. The decision to remove it first was right anyway. Thumbs up. MyNickIsTakenSoIUseThisOne 22:44, 25 August 2009 (UTC) -- Alexander

Level?[edit source]

It's not 1 to 20 is it?--Selty 06:56, September 5, 2009 (UTC)

The hard cap is still unknown, probably level 99 or so. Lots of room for expansions, heh. The character is expected to finish around level 18 to 22 in the official campaign. MyNickIsTakenSoIUseThisOne 07:12, September 5, 2009 (UTC) -- Alexander

I've changed it to "unknown". I read in the GameBanshee article that there it is no hard level cap and I suspect the level descriptions will go from character info-boxes anyway, so hopefully that will suffice. Loleil 07:25, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
Has anyone actually reached 20+ levels? I wonder because... seeing as the game seems to adjust depending on your level I am surprised there isn't a cap at the lower-end to prevent you from having all abilities from a single class. Any way to confirm this via cheats in the PC version (Level your self to 20 then see if you have an XP bar)?

I have reached level 22 with a character so breaking Level 20 is very possible. I think even with current DLC though, reaching Level 25 would be a very difficult thing to do. I did roughly 90% of the side quests and still ended up with Level 22 so I'm not sure about 25. If Bioware stays true to Mass Effect/Fallout 3 type of levelling and not other RPG's, my guess is the level cap will be between 25 and 40 because from what I can gather, you cannot playthrough the game again with the same character allowing you to double that level. Again, not sure but at the moment, having completed the game, with both DLC packs and most of the side quests, I see level 99 as totally impossible. --MiyuEmi 16:02, November 20, 2009 (UTC)

With some console commands, you can max out your level at 25. -Fightback

If anyone wants to explore this, I found a bug where you can get 750XP indefinitely by entering and exiting a door. When I finished The Gauntlet, I went back inside to check a chest I had missed, and exiting again, got another 750XP. Back and forth through the door would lead to potentially infinite XP, if you have the patience. If this works for other people, it could be used to spade the hard level cap. 20:41, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

Hard Level Cap[edit source]

Is definitely 25, at least for now. The whole "there is no hard level cap" thing they say in the Manual has been explained by Bioware staff; there is only enough content in the game to hit a maximum of level 23, even if you do every quest, get all codices, and kill every enemy yourself. You hit the soft cap before hitting the hard one, which allows them to continually raise the Hard cap through DLC/patches without appearing to do so, as long as the amount of content in the game never gives you enough experience to reach that level. Zakrael 17:25, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

We all know of the experience glitching tactics, so if one were to use these glitches while on hard or Nightmare, would the cap still be in effect. It does not seem to work if you change difficulties as I tried this to see if the no level cap existed. I'd find it a waste of playthrough to get to level 23 naturally on Nightmare only to glitch at the end to get all the experience points. And for those anti-cheaters, I've beaten the game twice without glitching and my 3rd playthrough is the one that's glitched. --FLaSHBaCK HaSH 00:46, December 20, 2009 (UTC)

Vandalism?[edit source]

I noticed all the quotes were removed by an unregistered IP. Is this vandalism or was it agreed upon? -LeoLab 22:38, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

I removed them because they were badly formatted, somewhat non-sensical and added nothing to the page. They felt like a badly planned afterthought.

Page title[edit source]

"The Warden" is not a good choice for this article, not only because he's not a Warden from the start, but that's not even what he's consistently called. The manual and in game text (not the other characters, but loading screens and such) refer to him as the "main character". Moving this article to Main character is the best choice because it is both timeline-neutral and what he is called in an official context to avoid ambiguity. And, for that matter, it's just a lot more wieldy as a title. 18:59, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

From what I've seen and done (3 playthroughs - finishing fourth), "The Warden" is in fact called such consistently after his/her joining. The only other variations would be My lord/lady and you or it in Shale's case. Calling him the "main character" removes really all context on him being a natural character as he's just some droned out name and we've already went through a first change from "player character" to "the Warden". Zf6hellion 20:13, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Picture[edit source]

I prefer the old one of the male used in the in-game trailers. I don't think a picture of a whole lot of presets is as effective. Usually, an RPG protagonist is given a canon character in all the trailers. I really think we should use the old one.--Selty 06:14, December 16, 2009 (UTC)

Without a female equivalent I have a problem with this. Loleil 06:28, December 16, 2009 (UTC)

Someone could always make a character using the the trailer versions settings and then make a female variant with the same settings, therefore granting a sort of "Gender Swap". Zf6hellion 15:45, December 16, 2009 (UTC)

It was my understanding that the PC used in promotional footage couldn't be replicated, but if someone can actually do this, it could be an option. Loleil 23:45, December 16, 2009 (UTC)

The trailers that use actual Gameplay can, I have done so but I can't get it on here cause I only have the PS3 version. Zf6hellion 01:11, December 17, 2009 (UTC)

Question about abilities[edit source]

Note: question moved from article --vom 14:31, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

NOTE: In all my plays (on XBox 360) I'm seeing my Human Rogue start with Combat Training, Improved Combat Training, Poison Making, and 1 Skill Slot.  Please confirm. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talkcontribs)

Sorry, this was my posting. This is my first time using this wiki. But yes, I just purchased the game for the XBox 360 and started off and noticed I had these three skills. Later I restarted and saw the same thing. Tivadar 14:34, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

I just verified that a starting human rogue gets both combat training and and combat training 2 on the XBox 360. Going to update the page. Tivadar 02:22, January 6, 2010 (UTC)

Ok, on the XBox (and presumably PS3) all Wardens start with the combat training skill in addition to the other default skills. Where they're supposed to get ranks in combat training, then the warden gets one additional rank as well. Tested with various classes/races and for every one I've done it's been the same. Tivadar 23:02, February 6, 2010 (UTC)

Sacred Ashes name[edit source]

Any sources out there supporting the Sacred Ashes Warden's name being Malcolm Cousland, like the article states? I'm curious, as I haven't found any. --Dubiel 22:04, March 14, 2010 (UTC)

Well doing a search for "Malcolm Cousland" redirects to this page (main not talk) and I can find many people on froums refer to the Warden as Malcolm Cousland I don't think the tralier wardens name is Malcolm. While it is impossible for The Warden to be human yet not a Cousland that doesn't really tell us his first name making such an assertion invalid.

Its been removed anyhow.( 23:43, March 20, 2010 (UTC))

Thanks. I did a little investigating and it turns out "Malcolm" is the name given to the default Warden used in Bioware's gameplay trailers, who is mostly identical to the CGI trailer Warden: This Warden is also shown in Awakening's trailers. Whether it's canon or not, at least I can see where the assertion comes from. --Dubiel 14:59, March 21, 2010 (UTC)

You know I never thought that the trailer Warden was a Human Noble, mainly because of his tattoo. I was looking at the page for tattoos in Thedas and it says that tattoos on humans means that they have some sort of tribal lineage. And, I don't think that the Couslands have a descendents from the alamari, and if so, why don't Bryce of Fergus have tattoos. My orginal thought about the trailer warden was that he was from the scraped avvar barbarion origin. --User talk:Super Warden 10:40, January 5, 2011

Well if one takes a look a demo vid from 2008 ( the name of the character (I'm assuming either commoner or barbarian origin) is Leander.

Orlesian warden[edit source]

With Awakening released ( in North America, still can't play it myself >:| ), I thought it might be wise to decide whether the orlesian warden should have his own page or simply be a sub-title in this article. Personally I think he deserves his own page, but that's just my opinion.

Matt-256 23:08, March 16, 2010 (UTC)

I'm all for the Orlesian Warden having his/her own page as it is somewhat a second protagonist from the original Warden. But then again more opinions should come in first before anyone makes a page on it I think. Zf6hellion 20:28, March 21, 2010 (UTC)

Nobody really cares if Orlesian Warden is made or not. A load of terrible articles are constantly springing up with crap content, so I can't see why a decent article with someing substantial can't be made. Dch2404 09:57, March 29, 2010 (UTC)

Extra Attribute/Skill/Talent/Spell points[edit source]

There should be a section that points out exactly how many extra points The Warden can gain aside from simply leveling up; otherwise it'd be easy to miss such things for a first time player utilizing the wiki.

should have[edit source]

i just realized that the game should have given the warden (and other grey warden companions) a spell/talent branch related to grey warden-ness: better protection against darkspawn, more effective attacks against darkspawn, and so on. that would have been really cool. 04:36, April 26, 2010 (UTC)Iaulle

Picture[edit source]

Okay, so, I really hate the profile picture we have. I want to change it to a female and male version of the warden when they are about to slay Loghain. This one doesn't have any appeal for people who are looking on this wikia and deciding on whether they want to buy this game. Selty 14:08, May 20, 2010 (UTC)

I still have a problem with something that excludes potential Wardens. The only other viable alternative I see is to remove images of the Warden from the infobox altogether. So we could go with a picture-less infobox or go with something more symbolic like this. Friendship small.pngLoleil Talk 01:09, May 21, 2010 (UTC)
I'm probably wrong and this is a dumb idea, but you could try this picutre; it's not explicitly male or female and I think it looks pretty cool. Abdeil
I'm not sure that would work as it is a cool looking pic, but it kinda looks like his face is made of flames and I know it's a guy ;). Friendship small.pngLoleil Talk 01:41, May 21, 2010 (UTC)

Is it impossible to change you appearance after you create you character?--Sangheili wunna be (talk) 07:12, June 17, 2010 (UTC)

Profile picture isn't a good representation of the warden. Bioware has chosen that trailer warden for the placeholder whether you like it or not. Abdeil's image is a good suggestion. --Gunsdelight (talk) 01:52, June 8, 2011 (UTC)Gunsdelight

"Whether you like it or not"? It's a placeholder that isn't even accurately represented in the trailers for the game. That isn't The Warden, that's a Warden. (talk) 02:09, June 8, 2011 (UTC)
I agree. The male Warden is Blur Studio's work, so it's not a good representation of the Warden in-game. Bioware may have chosen to use this Warden as a placeholder, but it doesn't mean we have to use it. --D. (talk · contr) 03:03, June 8, 2011 (UTC)

Blur Studio is also trusted with other trailers: Star Wars, Batman, Mass Effect, Fable, Bioshock, and others. It is The Warden because he's on the same quest you do in game in The Sacred Ashes trailer. All I'm saying is the current picture is not a good picture for representing The Warden. It's just a bunch of faces from the character creation.-- (talk) 19:18, June 9, 2011 (UTC)Gunsdelight

It is only a Warden "doing" the quest in-game, but it's a good representation of the game. The trailer Warden is not "the" Warden, much like Hawke in the Destiny trailer is not "the canon" Hawke. I don't think the Warden from the trailer should be used.
There's not a picture that is a good representation of the Warden if you want to put a face on him/her; the current picture is a compromise, although it may be changed to something else. Per Loleil's suggestion, it may either be no image at all, or the Grey Warden heraldy (I think it should be the achievement "Last of the Wardens" though—it's a bit more iconic for the Warden). --D. (talk · contr) 21:52, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Vandalism?[edit source]

Someone deleted the wardens story section and placed <: I'm presuming this is vandalism but dont know if I can change it back myself or more importantly how too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 13:01, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

appearances[edit source]

should witch hunt and all of the other dlcs for dao be added? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 21:39, 6 July 2011 (UTC)

No, it's implied that they appear in other DLCs. Mentioning them should only be if you must get the DLC in order to have the character (e.g., Shale with Stone Prisoner). --D. (talk · contr) 22:54, July 6, 2011 (UTC)

Aedan Cousland[edit source]

we know Aedan is the Default Warden, and the Human Warrior from the Trailers is Aedan Cousland as he's the only possible Human Male character, so why can't we use an image of him instead of the varying Wardens, we can keep them, but not use it for the main Image, because seeing as all Default Story Choices, rely on Default Human Warden, and thus far the default is Human male, surely we can use one from the Trailers? just an Idea Zachariah Zuan (talk) 21:32, October 16, 2011 (UTC)

I think the CGI Warden (Malcolm) and the Male Cousland Warden (Human Male Noble) are two different characters. You would also have to consider Daylen Amell (Human Male Mage). Malcolm would probably be from the Human Commoner Origin, which was taken out of the game for some reason. The demo trailer showing the Commoner Origin can found somewhere in this site or on another website. So in other words, Malcolm doesn't exist in Dragon Age: Origins. (This is from the top of my head, so correct me if I am wrong)--Fialdestiny (talk) 08:27, October 25, 2011 (UTC)
well mage is out the question after watching him use the sword and shield in the manner of a Warrior, I know of Arcane Warriors, but the manner of his skill I would assume he would be a Warrior, I did not know of the commener origin I shall look at it at once Zachariah Zuan (talk) 22:15, October 28, 2011 (UTC)
  • I think he's the unidentified individual on the torture rack at Fort Drakon, separate from the pile that includes heads that resemble Mallol and Gilmore. Obviously, if you're playing as a Cousland (take your pick), it would have to be someone else. DAWUSS (talk) 01:20, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

Dwarf Commoner[edit source]

It says that the Dwarf Commoner stopped eating "all for a stupid bet". I'm pretty sure that the bet Leske was referring to was the bet that Beraht placed on Evrand winning the Provings. Maybe this is what the sentence in the article meant, but it sounded more like it was implying that the Dwarf Commoner stopped eating because he made a bet to do so. So I'm not sure if that's just awkward wording or if it's implying that he made a bet to stop eating. StillAlive (talk) 02:52, April 21, 2013 (UTC)

Character name, royal title[edit source]

I took the liberty of verifying a couple of things in-game seeing as how there apparently seems to be some disagreement.

  • Length of the Warden's name: there is a maximum length of 11 characters
  • Consort Status: a male/female noble Warden who marries Anora/Alistair are referred to as Prince-Consort/Princess-Consort in the Origins epilogue. This is somewhat consistent with real-life royal practices.

I'm making the changes now, if there's any further disagreement about this, please discuss it here. Kelcat (talk) 22:14, September 2, 2013 (UTC)

Disagree with the later, agree with the former. There is in game confliction regarding whether the warden becomes Prince/Princess consort or King/Queen consort.
Prince/Princess consort vs
  • Origins epilogue
  • Warden codex DA2 (prince consort only)
King/Queen consort
  • Alistair/Anora at the Landsmeet (three times)
  • Alistair/Anora just prior to epilogue
  • Awakening epilogue slide (queen consort only)
  • Anora codex DAO (king consort only)
  • Warden codex DA2 (queen consort only)
  • Alistair codex DA2 (queen consort only)
  • Bodahn in DA2
  • Alisair in DA2 (queen consort only)
I would say the consort status used in the article should be King/Queen consort as their usage is both more frequent (as far as I can see Princess consort is used only once), and more recent. I do concede that there is an argument for the use of Queen and Prince consort instead, based on the fact the DA2 codex uses that pairing, but I would lean against for consistency sake.
Two side notes, on real life royal practice, Princess consort is never used for the wife of a king, likewise King consort is almost never used. In the case of the latter, historically husbands tended to simply assume their wives titles, not as consorts but as joint monarch (Mary I of England, and Philip II of Spain, for example). Second side note, consort should not be capitalised. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 23:21, September 2, 2013 (UTC)
Alistair does refer to the noble Warden as "my queen" at the Landsmeet, but that doesn't mean that's her official title. Likewise, Anora refers to the male Warden as "king", but in neither circumstance is it followed by "consort." Same with Alistair's codex in Dragon Age 2 (I can't find the Warden's codex on the wiki, so I'm not sure what it says).
As far as I can see, the titles King-consort and Queen-consort are never used anywhere--unless I'm missing something. Kelcat (talk) 23:37, September 2, 2013 (UTC)
Why are you under the impression that 'Princess consort' is the official title, rather than 'Queen of Ferelden'? Monarchical titles do not work like that. 'Queen consort' is not a title or style, like queen regent it is a term of differentiation. Queen consort Mary of Teck was officially titled and styled 'Her Majesty, the Queen', just as our monarch Elizabeth II is today.
Before reiterating the evidence I already provided above, I will cite precedent:
  • Queen Anora was queen consort to King Cailan
  • Queen Mairyn was queen consort to King Calenhad
  • Queen Rowan was queen consort to King Maric
All such examples show that that the wives of Ferelden King's all bore the title queen, none bore the title princess consort. Thus far we have no canon example of a male consort.
As for reiterating evidence:
  • Anora says to the Landsmeet once a decision has been made: "My husband, the king consort, general of my armies, and the hero who will save Ferelden"
  • Moments later at the Landsmeet Anora says to the nobles: "gather your forces and await the king consort's command"
  • The Epilogue for Awakenings says: "She returned to life at court, resuming her duties as queen of Ferelden and receiving a hero's welcome when she rode back into the capital."
  • Alistair's codex for DA2 says: "King Alistair Theirin was crowned ruler of his kingdom after the end of the Fifth Blight, with the legendary Hero of Ferelden reigning as his queen"
  • The Warden codex for DA2 says: "After ending the Blight, the Hero of Ferelden was wed to King Alistair and crowned queen of Ferelden. She and the king now rule the country together."
  • Just prior to the Epilogue Anora/Alistair says: "May I formally present my betrothed, who will soon be your king/queen"
  • Alistair says to Hawke "Well I supose I better get back to the old ball and chain" to which Teagen replies "you know the queen hates it when you call her that"
There is more, but I believe I've provided more than enough to prove my point. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 23:03, September 3, 2013 (UTC)
I do see your point about King/Queen being used, but not about adding the "consort" onto it. There's definitely conflicting info about the title (I don't recall Anora calling him King consort, but I only played the male Cousland through once). The epilogue in Origins specifically states Princess-consort/Prince-consort, and I've always taken that to be the canon titles seeing as how it's the epilogue. I honestly don't know what the precedent is for conflicting information, and I'm not entirely sure if "majority rules" is a good enough reason to change the info. It might be, but I don't know. My suggestion would be to see what the admins do when such a discrepency arises. Perhaps putting Prince-consort (King)/Princess-consort (Queen) would be a good alternative? (or the other way around). But I just don't think it should be King consort/Queen consort. As you pointed out, that's not a title. Therefore it shouldn't be listed under titles. Kelcat (talk) 23:44, September 3, 2013 (UTC)
There is no reason to take the Origins Epilogue as primary canon above other legitimate sources, especially given that in this particular circumstance it is contradicted in most other uses. I do agree that majority rules is not a way to decide, but given the stark discrepancies one does have to look at which usage is more common, especially when you consider that (as I've mentioned above) that Princess Consort is used only once. In addition, it would be a highly irregular usage of the title, given in one point that Princess Consort is only used for the wife of a Prince, and in a second that all prior Ferelden consorts have been titled 'Queen' (as has this one, numerous times). [Given the latter example, granting Lady Cousland the title Princess Consort when all her predecessors have held the title Queen would be an insulting slight on the Cousland family.]
As for your other points, Anora does indeed refer to Cousland male as the 'King consort' on several occasions, I can find a youtube link if you desire. If we want to look at 'documentation' as more concrete evidence, over say dialogue, then I would concede to the the usage of Queen and Prince consort. Awakening Epilogue (and dialogue) uses that pairing, as does Dragon Age 2 codexs for both the Warden and Alistair. In addition, it's in line with real world practices. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 23:16, September 10, 2013 (UTC)
On a side note, it does come to mind that the titles section of the infobox is looking rather busy. It might be worth only having 'Hero of Ferelden' (or all those s/he always gets) there with 'see below' for other titles, and thus create a section for other possible titles. With notes regarding which warden origin can obtain them, and the contradictory use of princess/king consort etc. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 23:29, September 10, 2013 (UTC)
As it stands, it doesn’t look like we’re going to come to any kind of consensus. We obviously have differing views of what the Warden’s title should be if they take the throne.
I looked at the wiki guidelines regarding consensus and it looks like the outcome in such situations is to leave the content as it originally was. Seeing as how Prince/Princess consort has been used on this page for quite some time, this means that it should remain that way. If other people want to weigh in on the discussion and see if we can come to an agreement that’d be great, otherwise guidelines say the info shouldn't be changed. 00:33, September 19, 2013 (UTC) Kelcat (talk) 00:33, September 19, 2013 (UTC)
Huh... what sorry? That's all you've got to say? How about addressing what I've said, rather than just ignoring and dismissing it. Our views do indeed seem to differ, but you've made almost no attempt to either take on board what I've had to said, or try and disprove it. Indeed, this latest ploy seems to me to be your fall back position where by you achieve your favoured outcome without discussion, but by pointing to wiki policy. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 13:59, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
I'm not ignoring or dismissing anything. All I'm saying is that we're obviously not able to come to an agreement. You have a lot of points and proof for why you think it should be changed and that's fine, but I still don't agree with it. I offered the compromise of putting Prince-consort (King)/Princess-consort (Queen), which I thought might satisfy everyone. If you'd like, you can make a forum post and get more feedback, but I'm not changing my opinion. Please don't make this into a personal attack. I'm not trying to achieve a favored outcome, I'm just trying to avoid edit wars. If others think you're right, fine. I cited wiki policy because, well, it's policy. It's there for just this reason. Kelcat (talk) 19:28, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
Also, to clarify--I'm arguing against King consort/Queen consort because those titles have never been used anywhere within the Dragon Age medium. I'd be fine with either Prince consort/Princess consort or King/Queen. But I'm not fine with putting in a title that's never been used by BioWare. Kelcat (talk) 19:53, September 22, 2013 (UTC)
First, I will point out that this very discussion has prevented an edit war. Since it started I have made no move to change the article to reflect my preference. Second, I never took anything as a personal attack, nor meant anything I said as one. I was merely slightly surprised that after debating your point so ably, that you would suddenly stop and just quote policy.
So on topic. King consort has indeed been used, as I mentioned above: here (13:55), (14:29) and (2:36). But as you say, Queen consort to my knowledge has not been used. But you say you're happy with King/Queen (or King consort/Queen if you accept the source I previously provided), then that is something that I am perfectly happy to agree with. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 12:15, September 23, 2013 (UTC)
My personal preference would be for something that reflected both the prince/princess consort and the king/queen as you have definitely pointed out the king/queen have been used--I don't doubt that point at all. I'm still not comfortable with the queen consort as it's never been used, but if you're adament about it I'm willing to concede. At this point, it's just not worth it to me to continue arguing the point. So in short, I'm fine with whatever you put. Hopefully others will be as well, and since we've been the only ones discussing it I'm assuming no one else has strong enough opinions about it.
I never addressed the issue of putting the titles under a separate part of the page, apologies for that. I think that's a good idea. I've never liked the idea of putting all those titles in the info box since they're spoilers. I'd recommend Warden and Warden-Commander in the infobox and then all the others further down under a spoiler tag? Kelcat (talk) 16:41, September 23, 2013 (UTC)
No, I agree with you about the usage of Queen consort... since it hasn't been used (to my knowledge) in Dragon Age media, then we shouldn't use it either. And If I were to interpret a real-world definition on the use of consort here, it is that 'King consort' has to highlight the fact that he is the husband of the monarch, rather than ruling in his own right.
Having a title section will also mean that we will be able to list both pair of conflicting titles, and note the confliction. Below is a suggestion of how we can list it in the article, along with the correct header and spoiler tags.
Possible titles:
  • Teyrn/Teyrna of Gwaren
  • Chancellor of Ferelden
  • King consort or prince-consort of Fereden – if married to Anora (male Human noble Warden only)
  • Queen or princess-consort Ferelden – if married to Alistair (female Human noble Warden only)
  • Paragon (Dwarven Warden only)
  • Bann of Denerim Alienage (City Elf Warden only)
What do you think? If you're okay with that we can go ahead and add it into the article, removing all but Grey Warden, and Commander of the Grey from the infobox. Alexsau1991 25px-Goddammit.svg.png (talk page) 15:45, September 24, 2013 (UTC)
That looks perfect to me! Kelcat (talk) 16:14, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

What's with the removal of the titles from the infobox? No reason why we can't have both the section on titles, and the titles listed. Henio0 (talk) 18:17, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

Well, as mentioned (somewhere) above, the list was pretty long and unwieldy, plus all those optional titles could be considered spoilers. Kelcat (talk) 18:28, September 24, 2013 (UTC)

The titles have been added back. Have we changed our consensus about it?User signature henioo.png henioo (da talk page) 14:33, January 15, 2018 (UTC)

Oops, I wasn't aware this conversation. Thanks for checking it out. The titles have been removed again. Na via lerno victoria 16:44, January 15, 2018 (UTC)

Categories[edit source]

In my view we shouldn't list everything the Warden can be in the form of categories (nobility, royalty, bards, shadows, champions etc.). Personally I'd like to restrict the categories for the Warden to Characters, Playable characters, Dragon Age: Origins characters, Dragon Age: Origins - Awakening characters, Grey Wardens, Fereldans (though I suppose we might extend this to include Humans, Elves, Dwarves). Thoughts? Chantry symbol.svg King Cousland | Talk   21:46, April 16, 2014 (UTC)

I think we should follow the example of wikipedia. What do they do there in those cases? Na via lerno victoria 14:05, June 6, 2014 (UTC)
I'm not sure if the two are really comparable. I mean, given that Wikipedia deals with factual content, are there any examples of articles there where it would be appropriate to list what someone could be? Chantry symbol.svg King Cousland | Talk   17:15, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Wrong Info for Dalish Elf Warrior[edit source]

I just started a Dalish Elf warrior on the pc and all the info was correct except that I started with the talent Pinning Shot, not Dual-Weapon Sweep as it says in the article. I am playing on the PC using the latest patch. I think someone should confirm this error on their own system before I edit the article. (talk) 16:12, August 27, 2014 (UTC)

Just tested it on the PC, and I do indeed have Pinning Shot. I also tested it on the XBox and it has Dual-Weapon Sweep, instead. Not sure about the playstation, though. --Kelcat Talk 01:26, August 28, 2014 (UTC)

About The Letter in Inquisition[edit source]

Are you sure the part of the letter regarding Morrigan and Keiran requires The Hero to have romanced Morrigan? Mine had romanced Leliana, performed the ritual with Morrigan, and I got both the Leliana romance paragraph in the letter, and the one for Morrigan. Morrigan's paragraph might show up for both an actual romance, and just for the ritual if it was the Hero himself who did it. (talk) 03:04, January 17, 2015 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure that's a bug, and shouldn't have shown up. There's definitely a bug that occurs when importing a female human noble, as there would be no logical reason for a female Warden to refer to Morrigan and Kieren as "my family". --Kelcat Talk 03:48, January 17, 2015 (UTC)

Question about Tabris[edit source]

Regarding the whole Tabris family name respected in Highever thing.

It's Valendrian merely stating the pairings for the City Elf Warden and Soris.

Soris gets Valora, and quote.

"As for Cyrion's child...Well, I'd rather not reveal the identity of the chosen match yet; the arrangements are still being made with the family and they may fall through, so I shoudln't get ahead of myself. You'll be pleased to hear the family is well respected in Highever, even by some humans."

Seems to me they aren't referring to the Tabris family in that line, but rather the family Tabris is going to be hooked up with. Which makes more sense, why would the Tabris name hold any weight over in Highever?

Surface dwarf[edit source]

Once I saw that in an issue and put the character in the Surface dwarf category and the category was issued. Now I ask the TW is an Surface dwarf? -- (talk) 17:47, January 20, 2016 (UTC)

I don't think so. Dwarven Wardens are Paragons post-Origins, so it would be impossible for a person to be both a surface dwarf and a Paragon. User signature henioo.png henioo (da talk page) 22:51, January 20, 2016 (UTC)

If he survives the Fifth Blight, he is promoted to the post of Warden-Commander, going to live on the surface. I think the truth is categorized as dwarf surface. (talk) 18:59, February 6, 2016 (UTC)

Again, this is tricky because the dwarven traditions are so rigid. The dwarves who fought in the fifth blight returned to Orzammar and were not casted out. The dwarves who live in Minrathous as ambassadors are also not considered surfacers. The Warden is a Paragon and the head of his/her own noble house, so they aren't surface dwarves, even if they do spend time on the surface. User signature henioo.png henioo (da talk page) 19:22, February 6, 2016 (UTC)
The Warden is a grey warden. Leske says that all dwarves who travel to the surface to become Grey Wardens retain their caste and house. --Virrac (talk) 21:15, February 6, 2016 (UTC)

Origins Alternate Scenarios[edit source]

Because apparently it's "speculation", a user had posted some thoughts into what happens to the City Elf if they're not the chosen origin and was promptly removed by a user called Virrac on the grounds of "speculation". Now I was merely looking through some of the walkthroughs for a quest until it caught my eye, and in all honesty I find it rather off how there's speculation regarding the Circle Mage and the Human Noble yet they're allowed to stay, so I reverted it explaining and asking why they're allowed yet Virrac again reverted without any reasoning.

"No mention is made of the Circle Mage. Likely became one of the abominations plaguing the Circle Tower following Uldred's revolt." - speculation on the assumption of what happened during his revolt, nothing to confirm or deny.

"Human Noble: No mention is made of the Human Noble. Most likely killed along with the rest of the Couslands during Arl Howe's attack on Highever." - while a likely scenario, still ultimately speculation.

So I fail to see why the user's contribution to the City Elf part of the section is removed on the grounds of speculation when these two origins also have speculation regarding it, hence why I've gotten myself involved in the edit war. If someone who's a higher up and not Virrac (who'll probably just keep saying it's speculation) can explain why the City Elf part can't stay it'd be much appreciated. (talk) 09:43, July 1, 2018 (UTC)

Your edit marked as speculation because of this it is almost impossible to city elf to receive the bribe because he/she cannot enter the castle without weapon. In city elf origin duncan is the one who give weapon so city elf can enter the castle and fight the guard. so even if city elf stormed the castle without weapon, he will be killed asap because he/she has no weapon for fighting guard. because of that it is impossible for city elf to receive bribe like you say.
Circle mage is not speculation because circle mage cannot go out circle tower without duncan, so he will be likely died or become abomination during revolt.
Human Noble is not speculation because only fergus who leave the castle before howe attack, and because howe kill all cousland family who didnt leave the castle, human noble will most likely killed too because no duncan who help to escape.
Sorry for my bad english, i hope you understand the explanation Wiryawan310 (talk) 14:21, July 1, 2018 (UTC)
Using the term "likely" makes it speculation as it implies uncertainty, thus contradicting what you're arguing. I understand what you're saying however it's still ultimately speculation, as I mentioned the Human Noble's outcome is more than likely that however we still have no idea, as the same for the Circle Mage saying it's likely they died/became an abomination is still speculating their fate.
I quite enjoy this Wiki so I'd rather not be a shit stain and cause an edit war, but the contradiction being placed by the wiki by Virrac is rather appalling, especially given how the only reasoning is "speculation", where ultimately the fate of the Human Noble and Circle Mage is still being speculated regardless of how likely their outcomes are if not selected, so I've removed the assumption of fate due to no real argument supporting either fate aside from the circumstances we see of the origins (for the HN) and the overall situation at the Circle (for the CM). (talk) 14:43, July 1, 2018 (UTC)

Actually Anon raises a good point about the human noble and circle mage origins. The one part I think we can take with certainty is that point of divergence in each origin is clearly duncan's presence. In the original draft, the city elf origin contained a greater degree of speculation than the others. First successfully breaking into the arl of denerim's estate and then taking vaughn's deal, yet strangely not being imprisoned. In contrast the human noble being bumped off by amaranthine soldiers requires far fewer leaps. I agree we should attempt to establish a degree of consistency here however. So I think the best course would be to not speculate past where duncan would have appeared in that origin. Leaving a single sentence saying no evidence of found of h. noble and mage and maybe a mention of soris being imprisoned for city elf. Does that sound amenable to everyone?

P.S I am also temporarily locking the article until we come to a consensus. -Seekers of Truth heraldry.pngHD3 (Talk) 07:07, July 2, 2018 (UTC)

No arguments from me, (no idea why my IP keeps changing) (talk) 08:13, July 2, 2018 (UTC)
I'm the one who triggered the minor war over the speculation regarding the fates of the other origins. I don't really have an issue with the present state of this page but I wanted to add some perspective/clarification of my original thoughts regarding editing that particular section.
I always play the City Elf Origin as female(blame that evocative concept art). In the female version the PC is taken captive at the same time as Shianni and the other elven women and the escape involves Soris rushing into the the cell where the women are being held and sliding a sword to the female PC so you can fight the guards. Since I always play this origin as a female, I did not consider the impact of Duncan's role in the male origin and I have no recollection of Soris mentioning Duncan helping him out with a weapon. Not to say that that didn't happen.Quorwyf (talk) 08:50, November 15, 2018 (UTC)
I just noticed something...people on this page seem to have forgotten that the Mage origin has 2 paths: you can either help Jowan freely or rat him out to Irving. We have no confirmation as the what the mage does in other origins as all paths lead to Jowan escaping after destroying his phylactery, but it is probable that a mage who helped a maleficar would be sent to Aeonar while a mage that opted to show loyalty to The Circle would remain in good standing with them and would have possibly been in the Circle Tower at the time of Uldred's uprising. Quorwyf (talk) 20:04, December 4, 2018 (UTC)

Involvement[edit source]

Is there a reason The Golems of Amgarrak is not included? --Revan's Exile (talk) 01:04, June 7, 2019 (UTC)

Main quote[edit source]

The main quote on playable characters is usually made by other characters (see Hawke and Inquisitor), considering Hawke's words are highly dependent on player's choices.

Subsequently I think this edit was in the right direction. Na via lerno victoria 04:55, January 17, 2020 (UTC)

Concur. DaBarkspawn (talk) 05:40, January 17, 2020 (UTC)
Agreed. Original quote was a better choice. --Evamitchelle (talk) 15:26, January 17, 2020 (UTC)
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