Talk:Stealing: Profitable Targets

Moved here:(Added the table, simply right click Insert Row to add a row and then input information. Neatness if you can please.)

RE: article when i made it was a concept draft so i did not made any table i knew how to but there was no need with not much data.

PS maybe it was my laziness

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OK Rogek's case is misleading info: "Items received" instead "Received 20 Sovereigns"! This is because there is one random simple item plus 20 Sovereigns.

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Is there any chance we could rename the page to something like Stealing: Unique Marks. That way we could add items to the list like the Bad Luck Charm while still listing all the "profitable" loots since they all come from unique NPCs anyway.

If no-one objects, I can make that change. Loleil 00:32, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

Just add the fixed items there are to steal

4.153.251.236 12:13, December 2, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous

Not sure who decided 51 cunning would let you steal from all the orange names in the game, but it certainly doesn't work in my game. 57 Cunning is not enough for me to steal from Irving nor from High Dragon(I cheated to see the dragon's pockets and can confirm they are EMPTY). There are also a few others i've run across that repeatedly issue a "Stealing failed." On Easy diffciulty you can get by with 51 cunning, sure, but not on Normal ...at least not in the game I'm playing. Also, there are far more Elites that I cannot steal from than Bosses. As I said elsewhere in this discussion, it's mostly the caster elites ...not sure why the casters are harder to steal from, they just are. Back on topic...can anyone else confirm being able to steal from Irving with ≤51 Cunning? 4.153.249.169 03:44, December 5, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous

Cunning 100?

I realize I'm not a min-max gamer by any means, but... how do you get to cunning 100 without cheating? Supposing you've got the starting 10-15? cunning, and then pump every single skill point you get into it... that still doesn't bring you up to 100, since you gain 3 per level, with a max level of 25-ish (and more realistically, you won't get past 23?). So, at most, 75 skill points. So, about 80-90 cunning, max. That's only if you decide to pump everything into cunning, of course, and leave the rest of your stats low. - Ancestralmask 21:46, December 2, 2009 (UTC)

you get about 5 more from The Fade, and there are, what? 5 tomes? plus you can get all the armor and rings that buff your attribute. So, its possible, but as you pointed out - a little crazy --Tierrie 22:07, December 2, 2009 (UTC)

Cheating or Not, its valuable. Here's why. Take Irving...cheating to boost your cunning so you can find out THEN AND THERE what it takes. This then gives people a heads up...Irving cant be stolen from (as an example). Hope this is clear. Cypherdiaz 02:57, December 3, 2009 (UTC)

Skill Level?

Just wondering if other people thought the skill level row was necessary, the main thing I think is that people can know who, what and where. I also think it might be difficult to prove a minimum level. I don't know if scaling is involved, but I was able to steal plenty of things and never went above level two in the skill. Loleil

• Until someone can say for certain that skill/attributes do not play a factor in success/fail rates then I think we need to keep that information available. It may very well be that skill level really doesn't matter and a list like this could provide clear evidence of that, but until we get a LOT more reports from the community I think we should keep the information as is. I just think it's too early to say one way or another. 4.153.252.73 04:38, December 3, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous
• Maybe we should actually rename the collumn to "Minimum Required" -- then if, for example, you see that Item X is listed as being stolen with Stealing 4, Stealth 2, and 30 Cunning but you just stole it in your game with Stealing 2, Stealth 0, and 22 Cunning you could update the information.
• Also, does anyone know if Character level affects success/fail rates in any way what-so-ever? Does the game scale the difficulty of marks to the Warden's actual level? 4.153.255.63 09:00, December 3, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous

Status Effects?

I fully concede that it may be just random coincidence, but has anyone else noticed a modest increase in success rate when your target is stunned and/or knocked down? I've tried just about everything to be able to steal from some enemy NPCs but a few are notorious for giving me failures (like most of the Elite/Yellow darkspawn casters). In most games stealing success rates sky rocket when your opponent is Asleep or Paralyzed. In DA:O I think the design team slept through that discussion. Anyway... here's what I've tried and please provide feedback from your own experiences:

• Status of Target - Effect on Pickpocketing
• Sleep - None
• Horror - None
• Paralyzed - Haven't tried
• Waking Nightmare - Haven't tried
• Frozen - Minimal Increase, if any (This to me should make pickpocketing 100% fail since your loot is in a block of ice ....right?)
• Petrified/Stone - Haven't tried (This to me should make pickpocketing 100% fail since your loot is now incorporated into a statue)
• Knocked Down - Modest increase
• Stunned - Minimal Increase, if any
• Stunned and then immediately Knocked Down - High Increase (Best results so far, this is what I always use if the first attempt fails. 80% of the time it produces a success)
• Attack/Defense Debuff - Minimal Increase (Really didn't test this much)

Also, has anyone tested to see if Success/Fail is in any way related to the Thief's ATTACK vs. the Mark's DEFENSE? I first came across this when my Thief was hampered by three different negative hits to his Attack at the same time--I failed to steal from a trivial NPC (Genlock). As soon as the debuffs were gone I was able to steal again. I only tried a few times to raise my thief's attack while stacking multiple negative defense effects on the enemy. Early tests hinted at a somewhat higher success rate, but it needs a LOT more testing. The only NPCs I have routine failures on are the Elite caster Darkspawns and they can be few and far between. Again--I totally concede that this could be coincidence and nothing more; I would just like confirmation one way or another. Please give feedback!

4.153.252.73 04:38, December 3, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous

Love Letter

Orzammar - The Diamond Quarter Random Noble Lover Letter* -- Can someone confirm this? Being able to steal a letter is conflicting information with the Correspondence Interruptus page, and I was unable to get a letter after successfully stealing from all nobles in the Diamond Quarter. Perhaps it's the same letter as is able to be acquired elsewhere?--Timefounder 23:58, December 4, 2009 (UTC)

Coins vs Items

I doubt I'm the only person to notice that sometimes a NPC will give an item and sometimes it will give raw currency. For example, the 1.91g I listed from Harrowmont was on my first steal attempt; the next time I recieved a lyrium potion. A few things to discuss:

• Do all "Valuable Item" NPCs have a chance to give money?
• What are the common loot tables, if any?
• What factors determine how much money you recieve?
• What is the probability to receive either money or an item?
  • I seem to get an Item about 80% of the time (assuming the NPC had something to steal to begin with) but that is a very rough estimate.
    • On super rare occasions I have gotten money + an item. I'm thinking the game decided to give me money at that particular instance but then the NPC had a unique item so it had to reward me with that as well. Just thinking out loud.

Please discuss! 4.153.249.169 04:05, December 5, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous

I've found this to be true, I started to change them yesterday to "One Valuable Item" but I didn't want to cause I didn't recall, what I got for sure from those targets. Anyone that appears to give 1 or better seems they will give items of value as well.

I tested with Anora at least 15 times or so, the very first time I received like 3 81, then out of several more attempts (by reloading save) the items was constantly different, mostly getting Greater Health Polutice, 2 more times I got roughly 2 31 and finally 3 18 so my guess would be her range happened to be something like 2-4

I would further go to say in light of such, this table is nearly useless because of this outside of some completely static items, otherwise we might as well list every "Orange" named NPC as giving a valuable item, since it seems they always have something of value.

Kilandor 04:52, December 5, 2009 (UTC)

From what I've seen I would classify the loot tables into the following categories:

• Normal Marks (White Names)
  • Lesser Health Poultice
  • Various low level Traps (from rogues)
  • Most (if not All) Crafting components with the exception of Flasks and Agents (most components seem specific to NPCs: Lyrium Dust from mages, Frozen Lightning from supernatural creatures, Metal Shards from rogues, etc.)
  • Small amount of Silver (5-20s)
  • Minor Gemstones (Quartz, Greenstone, Fluorspar, etc)
• Elite Marks (Yellow Names)
  • Health Poultice
  • Medium amount of Silver (20-60s)
  • Medium Gemstones (Malachite, etc.)
• Boss Marks (Orange Names)
  • High end Gemstones (Sapphire, Turquiose, Diamond, etc.)
  • Large amounts of money (1-4g)
  • Greater/Potent Health/Lyrium Poultice/Potion (I've only seen Lyrium potions via stealing from Orange marks)

Enchantment (Enchantment!) Runes, Lesser/Greater [Elemental] Salves, and Shale's crystals fall into those categories somewhere but I'm not sure where. I know I got a ton of runes from the Dwarves in Orzammar. I also realize I probably only listed half the loot that one can attain from pickpocketing but I've been up all night and my brain is running on empty. Feel free to add your input.

If an NPC produces a pickpocketed item that falls into one of those 3 categories then I agree that we have no business putting it into the table. NPCs that produce items like Hardy's Belt, 20g, Flawless Crystals, etc. definetly SHOULD be in the table. Now technically the page is directed at "profitable marks" so indeed we should list every single NPC with an Orange name (because their loot has a higher sell value to merchants)...but I really think the spirit of the page is more along the lines of "unique marks" and would love to see it go in that direction.

4.153.249.182 15:58, December 7, 2009 (UTC)Anonymous

Stealing in the fade

Stealing from alistair during the fade gave me an imperium crossbow.

This was before talking to him back to his senses (in one of those nightmare sections)

i am not sure whether this is supposed to happen or not so needs confirmation.