|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Night Terrors article.|
Successful temptation resist
Has anyone figured out what determines a successful temptation resist? I have now played through this mission on two completely different playthroughs, once with Isabella and once with Merril as my lovers - both with max friendship upon doing this quest. They both betrayed me in both completely separate playthroughs (with different choices made throughout). I never sided with the sloth demon though.
It's kind of annoying, since it seems like a significant point, especially in terms of Merril - many party members remark how she was once successfully tempted by a demon (I'm assuming they're referring to this quest) and try to imply that hers and the champion's love cannot last because of that. I assume that different dialogue should occur, if Merril can resist temptation? I really don't know.
- With Merrill right around 50% Friendship (hard to tell, but no flirtation options during her apology) and Isabella and Aveline in the party, picking the sarcastic response had her turn but had no Friendship/Rivalry change. Then picking the sarcastic response for Isabella (between 50% and 95% Friendship) with Desire got +5 Friendship even though she turned. I'm hesitant to put this on the page until it's confirmed. --Morgan-wolf (talk) 02:23, March 18, 2011 (UTC)
Does anyone know what the music is that plays during the cinematic where the Keeper is walking through the Alienage?
Barrel puzzle bug
Does anybody know what you need to do to unlock this quest? As in, does it matter how you solve the "wayward son" quest line, or does this quest trigger no matter what? -Ancestralmask (talk) 00:59, March 19, 2011 (UTC)
Companions always turn
Can people stop using wishful thinking as evedience for something that isnt there? The fact is that your companion WILL TURN ON YOU. you cannot aviod it with a romance, or a high Friendship/Rivary rating, or chosing the correct response. I had Merrill in a romance with perfect friendship and i replayed it to try every responce. She still turned. As interesting as it would be for characters to resist Bioware found it more interesting for them to turn and then have them apologize for it, so the player can get some points and develop the relationship. So unless someone comers up with video eveidence of a companion not doing so, can we please consider this fact. And to the post above, yest if you choose the sarcastic option just before Isabella attacks, you get +5 Friendly.--Ironreaper (talk) 03:40, March 19, 2011 (UTC)
Info - during Torpor (Sloth Demon) I did choose to listen and asked all questions until I got to the Power, Knowledge or Magic offers on which Merrill comments that it is not a good idea to take the offer and after choosing none of the offers and rejecting at this point results in a fight but in "none - 0" rivalry or friendship points for Merrill (not sure about Anders, Fenris or Aveline).
Fenris does not turn on you, maybe because he's infused with Lyrium or what ever, I don't know why. I just tried it, he does not turn on you, perhaps he's like anders and turns on you if you take the deal, didn't try that however.
- I just did this quest not 5 minutes ago and Fenris turned on me. I'm in agreement with Ironreaper. I believe they all turn on you except Anders, who will if you accept the deal with the demon. So until I see evidence I will not believe any other claim. Vegnas (talk) 16:38, March 27, 2011 (UTC)
- I can personally confirm the above - Companions will always turn on you. I've gone into the Fade with everyone companion for a walkthrough I'm working on and I've seen them always, always turn. Did you go in there with Fenris and Merrill or Varric? The order he tries to seduce people seems to be Merrill (the easiest), Fenris and then Varric (the hardest).Misfit119 (talk) 06:04, March 28, 2011 (UTC)
- Like Misfit above said, companions WILL turn on you disregarding any friendship/rivalry with them. Who you take with you matters however, as each demon will only turn one companion. Taking Anders, Fenris and Isabela for example results in Fenris being tempted in Merril's place.
You may disagree but I have done this quest a number of times and there are different results each times. It is not universal that each demon will turn one companion. I have had it happen that only one campanion is turned. Last time I did this Fenris was turned but Varric wasn't. The time before Fenris was not turned but Merrill was. Anders never turns unless you deal with the sloth demon.--Diosprometheus (talk) 19:27, May 16, 2011 (UTC)
Dios, you aren't getting it. a companion will always turn. Each demon has a list of companions that they can turn. Each companion is ranked among the others of which one will be turned. The Pride demon will turn Merrill OR Fenris OR Varric. The Desire demon will turn Isabela OR Aveline. But in either side, only ONE will be turned. When they say that every companion will turn, they don't mean all at once, they mean that there is nothing you can do to prevent a companion from turning if they are tempted. No amount of friendship, rivalry, romance, or anything you can say will stop them. Anders become Justice, and is not able to be tempted with anything (though he will turn on you if you accept Torpor's deal), and Sebastian refuses to enter the fade. So, as further explanation, when Fenris was turned and Varric wasn't (in your situation), it was because Fenris comes before Varric when facing the demon, and only one person can be turned per demon encounter. Because of this, Varric did not turn. If you also had Merrill, then only Merrill would have turned, and nobody would have turned at the desire demon. Understood? --18.104.22.168 (talk) 23:10, June 12, 2011 (UTC)
I entered the Fade with modded-in player characters on the PC version and I lost none of them to any demon, since they are programmed mostly for the default characters: the Pride Demon affects Fenris, Merrill, and Varric, while the Desire Demon affects Isabela and Aveline. (VicGeorge2K9 (talk) 21:25, July 23, 2011 (UTC))
Previously I've gone into this with Varric, Isabela and Merril, early in act two; the fights have usually been fairly long but manageable. This time however, I brought in Varric, Fenris and Aveline; at level seventeen no less. Let me tell you, Fenris and Aveline present two incredibly high paced brutal fights, which are over FAST!!! Best advice I can give; upon the first salvo, click the tactical menu, click ALL companions to attack the traitor, use stun as an opening move, and dump ALL high power talents into them, because once they move, you're are screwed, particularly the second traitor (mine was Fenris); the demon is a minor side dish after that. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 06:28, March 1, 2013 (UTC)
Red Barrel Puzzle
IMHO, this "solution" given for the barrel puzzle is impossible to understand. Could somebody please update it and make it more specific? "Move left-right-middle barrels" and "move rotated barrels" just isn't helping me, and this since this puzzle gives you two attribute points, I'd like to know the answer. (I've already tried 6 times, fought demons 6 times, I am DONE for this playthrough)
- Seriously, this "puzzle" needs a write up? I accidentally did both puzzles first time around first time. Once the barrels become opaque, it's fairly obvious what to do.
I used the alternative explanation. The written one is just way too confusing. The written explanation for the first one was understandable but the second one is just insane. And it may be easy for you but for other people it's not fairly obvious what to do. --Ishimura Elite (talk) 20:30, September 29, 2011 (UTC)
Once one is aware of what the puzzle wants you to do (which is the difficult part as it seems to have no clue, for ages I thought the reward was an encounter with a demon after stumbling on the "right" combination) then it is so ridiculously easy, why would anyone need a solution written or otherwise ? The worst is being sure which barrel is supposed to be red, as at the sides of the pile their colour is a bit indistinct. 22.214.171.124 (talk) 12:03, October 11, 2014 (UTC)
Tome of the Slumbering Elders
What does it do because I got it but cannot find it in my inventory.--
Death in the fade
When Marethari and Hawke enter Arianni's house, she pulls you away to ask you to kill Feynriel if he does become possessed within the fade. She explains that a death within the fade will make him tranquil. Any idea if this is canon? It makes little sense, given that Anders or Merrill that've turned on you will not become tranquil. In the follow-up talk with Anders, if he turned on you, he also asks if you knew whether or not he would wake up alive - ???. Messy writing, or is there some explanation I'm missing?
I believe the reason for this is that Feynriel is a unique case, as he is a dreamer and has been drawn closely into the fade by his powers and the demons. For him to have such a strong connection to the Fade, and the nature of his trip into it, means he has a different reaction to being killed in the Fade then Hawke and co.--Ironreaper (talk) 06:28, April 24, 2011 (UTC)
- That explains Feynriel, but what about your mage companions if they die in the Fade? They don't come out tranquil, either. --Morgan-wolf (talk) 18:13, April 26, 2011 (UTC)
- Cheers Ironreaper, that explains a few things (I'm the one who asked the question, btw.) So then Feynriel's unique case means that if he dies in the Fade, he'll simply become tranquil. Back in Origins some Tranquil dude at Ostagar mentions that 'your forehead is branded with magic' during the normal process performed by templars. From this I'll assume that any other mage that dies in the Fade doesn't turn Tranquil, and will in fact, just wake up. (Is it just me, or was that mentioned somewhere in-game as well?) This still doesn't explain the bit in Anders' conversation following this quest. Can we assume that because of Justice, he might also have reacted differently to be killed in the Fade, whereas all the normal mages (Merrill, Hawke) would just wake up? Dustcollar (talk) 18:27, April 26, 2011 (UTC)
I'm thinking it's mostly Feynriel's dreamscape within the Fade that they are entering, and that it mostly affects Feynriel, as Hawke and his companions are only visitors in it and their deaths would just simply make them wake up in the real world. (VicGeorge2K9 (talk) 21:33, July 23, 2011 (UTC))
That all sounds like an 'after the event is noted', "It's not a bug, it's a feature", type explanation to me. Either something happens to all mages or to none. Still, just my opinion. 126.96.36.199 (talk) 12:20, October 11, 2014 (UTC)
- The Talk pages are really more intended for discussion of the article rather than the lore. If you would like to discuss that with other people in more detail, I suggest trying the forums. You'll get more responses and feedback.
Torpor conversation glitch?
Something about the conversation strikes me as odd, like the order of lines is messed up. You're able to find out a few things from Torpor via the investigate menu before even asking what deal he is offering. If you do, Hawke says something along the lines of 'So if I help you possess Feynriel, you won't attack Kirkwall?' , implying that Torpor had already mentioned the deal. Seems to me like there's a line missing there somewhere. Is it just me? Dustcollar (talk) 09:20, April 10, 2011 (UTC)
While in the Fade, Anders is automatically placed in Vengeance mode. However, after exiting the Fade, he is now stuck in this mode. The "mode-active" symbol displays in the lower right-hand corner of the screen, but since the ability is not actually unlocked, I cannot control it through the quick bar or through Tactics. Phasmantistes (talk) 13:06, April 17, 2011 (UTC)
- Not 100% sure, but I think just taking Anders with you auto-activates the ability in the Fade (as in, extra talent). I was always able to use Maker's Wish and get a free ability point out of the whole trip, since I bought Vengeance beforehand. Did he have Vengeance before the quest? Dustcollar (talk) 15:46, April 17, 2011 (UTC)
Merrill and Torpor
I didn't get any negative points with Merrill, in this interaction. She's moved in with me, full friendship, and I heard the demon out, before picking "Anders is right." instead of "Back off, Anders!". Anybody else?
Currently, the sentence written in the Bugs section makes zero sense. I was going to try to fix it but I can't make heads or tales of what it means. Also, I ran into a bug with the first barrel puzzle (PC version) that isn't noted. The barrels don't move at all (I've read this is happening for the other barrel puzzle but haven't gotten that far). From reading Mulletz' post in this thread, it seems that the game mechanics are working but the graphics aren't displaying. I can confirm through trying to do the puzzle that his assertion seems to be correct but I've been unsuccessful thus far in getting the puzzle to complete via walkthrough. Millahnna (talk) 19:19, May 12, 2011 (UTC)
This may or may not be a bug, but there seems to be a cheesy one swipe kill in this quest and the quest also turns off any modes you may have on Hawke making him or her even more vunerable to being killed by the one swipe kill. At least this is the case on Xbox.--Diosprometheus (talk) 19:31, May 16, 2011 (UTC)
Not sure if I was lucky, but the daemon battles seemed ridiculously easy. Even after Merrill abandoned the party, Fenris and Anders double-teamed them, dispatching them in short order - all I had to do was stay out of the way. Then I re-tried solo, and still had no trouble - Decoy works really well! Tungstic (talk) 00:45, May 27, 2011 (UTC)
- Try turning up the difficulty level. Mine was at normal and I felt the same thing as you, though I was also at level 19. One of the couple issues I have with DA2 is the inconsistency with the difficulty level throughout the game, as most battles at normal level seem a little on the easy side, but if you turn to "hard" level, then quite a few boss fights will become too difficult, with even one or two normal fights becoming too hard. "Swarm" tactic to increase the challenge really doesn't work well, and the enemies dropping out of thin air gets really old after a while (not to mention detracts from realism, since not all situations or enemies fit that kind of entrance). On the note of difficulty, the very first elite boss (Ancient Rock Wraith) wore down my patience to zero with the way its health went down ever so slowly. It wasn't hard figuring out the strategy, but come on... With the painstakingly slow way its health decreased almost single point by single point under my attack, it took absolutely forever to kill it. Except for one golem fight in the treasure room for Golems of Amgarrak, I've never had to go down to "casual" difficulty before for anything in Dragon Age, and yet I couldn't even pass this fight at "casual". I got so bored in fighting the endless fight in the end, I had to just use the kill all enemies cheat to get it over with.
- The fights in this quest were very easy for me as well and I was playing on hard (yeah, the rock wraith's health was ridiculous, killing it at that difficulty level took about half an hour). The only even remotely troublesome battle was when I solved one of the barrel puzzles wrong and had to fight that rage demon with just Anders in my party. I killed the Pride Demon and Fenris in seconds! This is probably a bug. --18:01, May 29, 2011 (UTC)
- The Approval page says it depends on Sebastian having dialogue during the talk with Arianni. After experimenting it seems you must have either Fenris or Isabela in your party to give their line which allows him to respond. CLuhrsen (talk) 02:26, February 1, 2014 (UTC)
Not sure, I'd have to check next time I play. However, I do think it's funny that the official strategy guide suggesting taking Sebastian with you, especially on Nightmare difficulty, because he is immune to temptation. So, apparently the final beta build you could take Sebastian, but it was changed with launch. AbsolutGrndZer0 (talk) 01:34, November 10, 2011 (UTC)
I think the page needs editing. "Note: If Sebastian is in your party with Fenris or Isabela when you talk to Arianni, Sebastian disapproves Rivalry (+10)." That bit clearly suggest you ought not take neither Isabel nor Fenris as to do so would result in Sebastian having rivalry not approval. Which is why I expected to get Sebastian +10 approval, and seems I was robbed of it for taking that advice. 188.8.131.52 (talk) 18:36, June 4, 2015 (UTC)
- There are still formatting issues and some of the writing is subpar. --D. (talk · contr) 00:37, October 7, 2011 (UTC)
- It'd be rather long to point out what is wrong with this article in detail as the page is lenghty. In general, the page should be clear of redundancy or anything that makes awkward sentences or if it breaks the flow of the article (for example, the note regarding Sebastian in the Acquisition section). As for the formatting issues, it is mostly about how the information is presented (use of wiki markup for lists, use of templates such as Template:Note although it should be used sparingly, etc.), as well as consistency within the article itself. In addition, the layout of the page should try to follow our current guidelines for quests. As such, "Ending outcomes" should actually be within the walkthrough section, as well as the puzzles. The "Result" section would give a brief summary in regards to the plot. When you believe the article looks fine, you can remove the tag (it doesn't have to be "perfect" or anything).
I feel as though I cannot do much more cleaning in this article (at least not particularly constructive cleaning), so I have removed the clean-up tag. Further cleaning is encouraged, though, especially in the "Puzzles" section. Emil Olai (talk) 07:22, October 13, 2011 (UTC)
(From the main page) ■If you use the Hold Position command as soon as you enter the Fade, and go to the second barrel puzzle with the red barrels, it triggers the effect of you walking out and talking with Torpor. If you side with him and choose Power, this will automatically give you a specialization point, making it possible to gain all three specializations.
Wondering if this is in fact possible? I've tried it a few times with no success (I'm on Xbox BTW) I have had weird interations with Torpor when I go through to the barrel puzzle room, but I havent been able to receive anything from him. As a side note I'm going in with very high level 13, so end up gaining one specialization point during the quest anyways, but that shouldn't matter should it? Thoughts? 184.108.40.206 (talk) 16:22, June 7, 2012 (UTC)
- I never tried this, but another user added a note regarding this. However, I don't know if the exploit is for PC users only, or it simply doesn't work for Xbox, or it has been patched. The user had not specified the platform and patch version. I'm leaving the bug on the page with the confirm tag until then. ··· d·day! 17:45, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
Well, just tried it (because I would love to have all three specializations) on the PC, patch version 1.04 and I can't seem to get it to work. I hit HOLD as soon as it loaded, then went straight to the second set of barrels and it didn't do anything that it shouldn't. So, either it's not a PC bug, or it's been fixed at some point. AbsolutGrndZer0 (talk) 21:20, August 30, 2013 (UTC)
I've already got 2 specialization points & carefully looked through every quest guide to get the third one. However, to no avail, I COULDN'T get the 3rd one on my PS3 (patch 1.05) for this quest specifically. So, I would say this bug has been debunked for ALL platforms.(220.127.116.11 (talk) 03:58, December 15, 2013 (UTC))
Out of devilment, given I'm probably playing II for the last time (maybe) and awaiting Inquisition, I opted to encourage Feynriel to accept the demon's offers both at Pride & Desire scenarios. It seems it is difficult to mess that quest up since it didn't effect his final reaction.
I have taken Anders in, in previous play-throughs, this time he isn't pickable from the selection page ! Unsure why not, maybe he's upset about being 100 rivalry this time ?
Or a sudden thought, maybe because he's still sorting processions after Ser Alrik ?
"It is recommended to stop the party members from following you as you chase the book and try to interact with it." No point. Stand in one spot, don't chase. Allow it to come to you and hit the spacebar (pause) then you have all the time in the world to click on it. 2A00:23C5:BA33:7200:D0D8:D1C7:2E42:75F2 (talk) 09:43, March 3, 2018 (UTC)