|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Merrill article.|
Merrill appears in at least three screenshots I've seen at other sites before, and I'm certain that one of those had a better close-up on her, but I haven't been able to find it yet - and if someone does find it before me, feel free to update the profile :) . DarkSpecie 20:31, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
Romance/friendship conversation? Edit
Regarding my latest edit, I just ran through the Dalish origin as a male. I couldn't replicate any conversation that suggests Merril is romantically involved with the Warden, though one can infer that she's friends with the Warden. While Tamlen's missing, she's all business and will only talk about going to rescue Tamlen. After returning with Duncan, if you try to talk to her, she only says that you need to go talk to the Keeper. SoyJuice 19:39, March 6, 2010 (UTC)
- I am playing through this origin right now. I recall Tamlen saying something during the initial run in with humans, then the line "Merrill and I were to announce our Union. Tamlen was to bear our shield." is one of the conversation options with Maren in the time between being brought back by Duncan and leaving to search for Tamlen. Anyone else seeing this line? I only caught this as I was wondering if there was any note about Merrill switching genders depending on the gender of the Warden while playing a female role to get some gender specific achievements.--TripCyclone (talk) 00:06, December 7, 2010 (UTC)
Companion in DA2...yet there is no proof Edit
Seriously, the source cited for her being a companion [] is just one poster on the Bioware forums who does not provide any source to verify his claim. Though I am not necessarily doubting his claim that this was found in some German magazine, we should probably wait for a verifiable source before we make this fact in the article. Balitant (talk) 23:10, December 31, 2010 (UTC)
Made changes to reflect this. Instead of being confirmed as a companion I made a note for her being a possible companion. There is literally no way for us to confirm if this is true, so let's not jump the gun. Balitant (talk) 23:34, December 31, 2010 (UTC)
Confirmed companion in DA2, Dalish Elf seen in recent Gamespot preview and confirmed as Merrill by David Gaider. http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/5680738&lf=8 13:27, January 10, 2010 (PST)
To the above, that is not a confirmation that she's a companion. Gaider's comment only confirms that yes, that elf IS Merrill. There's been nothing official that she's a companion. Although it's more than likely that she is, there's been nothing to confirm it to date. --Arteris (talk) 15:12, January 11, 2011 (UTC)
Just to add, David Gaider commented on this topic today.Here is the post http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/5787608&lf=8. I wouldn't say shes a confirmed companion yet by a long shot. Also the claim in the German magazine is very unreliable since is also said fenris would be a mage which Gaider said was very false. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 15:37, January 21, 2011 (UTC)
- I'm not disagreeing with what you guys say, since it's true that she has not been officially announced as a companion. However, I do think she is at least a confirmed temporary companion, per Seb Hanlon's post (unless the developers are tricking us). I guess, because of Cassandra's book, everyone is saying that she is a permanent companion, which is not enough to confirm she is one. --D. (talk · contr) 15:53, January 21, 2011 (UTC)
Guys don't you think it's too early to add "Dalish Pariah" as Merrill's specialization? I mean it's all based on a translation from the PC Games mag which is written in German, and though the word "Paria" in German is exactly translated to "Pariah" in English I think it's still premature to put it out there, they could have used that word because there's no other equivalent in German to words like "Outcast"... let me know what you think. VeNiX (talk) 19:30, January 21, 2011 (UTC)
- I agree, I am not convinced that this is a correct translation. Especially considering a german speaker said the correct translation for part of the article is basically that she was asked to accompany Hawke, not forced or outcast. --BTCentral (talk) 21:17, January 23, 2011 (UTC)
I'm all for pictures, but do we really need two pictures of almost the same appearance? I prefer the first picture. It could be cropped more by removing the left arm. --D. (talk · contr) 22:34, January 10, 2011 (UTC)
- Heh, I didn't see this one, which is the cropped version. I think it's better. --D. (talk · contr) 22:36, January 10, 2011 (UTC)
- I think she has strong resemblance to her Origins look as well, Isabella looked like in her late 30s in Origins while she looks like mid 20s in DAII, so I like that they kept Merrill's look intact. VeNiX (talk) 08:09, January 13, 2011 (UTC)
Romance Option in DA2? Edit
Given the companions preview on G4, it's looking as if Merril is the second female love interest: "From virginal girl next door *show interaction with Merril* to crazy up against the wall let's have it on right here *show interaction with Isabela*" Tivadar (talk) 15:13, February 9, 2011 (UTC)
- Mike didn't even mention Merrill in the G4TV preview video, you're talking about the dev diary... and even then Gaider didn't deny or confirm she's a romance interest he just reminded us not to read too much into the romance archetype... either way she's still not confirmed as a romance. VeNiX (talk) 15:49, February 9, 2011 (UTC)
- Sorry, I'm referring to this video, http://www.g4tv.com/videos/50699/Dragon-Age-2-Making-Of-The-Story-Trailer/, or "Dragon Age 2: Making of the story", starting at about 3:30, there's no mention of Merril specifically, but they show a scene with whom I'm pretty sure is her with regards to romance. Check it out. Tivadar (talk) 16:28, February 9, 2011 (UTC)
- David Gaider specifically warned in the Merrill thread on the BSN that just because that voice-over was going when Merrill appeared, doesn't necessarily mean that it pertains to her. Here's the post ---> http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/5682342/1#5682374 Arteris (talk) 17:21, February 9, 2011 (UTC)
- As I said before, he was talking about the romance archetype, not the possibility of her being a love interest, in fact he even expanded on this issue on another thread where he said that "virginal" doesn't pertain to an actual state in-game, I guess we'll have to wait and see but as of now it's neither confirmed nor denied. VeNiX (talk) 17:25, February 9, 2011 (UTC)
Yep, you're all entirely correct that it's too early to add it as fact at this point, given that she's not even confirmed as a companion. Just saying we should keep our eyes open because it's looking *likely* she will be a romance option. Also, virginal was referring to her personality type, but it was discussed when romances were being discussed, which is all I was meaning to say. Tivadar (talk) 19:38, February 9, 2011 (UTC)
- I noticed the edit as well, however I didn't opt to remove it because recently it's been confirmed that Aveline is not a romance option, and since all companions have been announced that leaves only Merrill, I'm still waiting for official word but at this point I don't see any harm in leaving it there, it's 99% true anyway. VeNiX (talk) 15:01, February 11, 2011 (UTC)
- It's not a big assumption at this point I think, in the dev diary, they said they've made love interests ranging from "virginal girl-next-door" to "crazy up against the wall", that's basically two romance options and since Aveline is out of the equation Merrill is certainly the second option. VeNiX (talk) 16:11, February 11, 2011 (UTC)
I removed the romance speculation. Yes, I think she's romancable. I even have reason to believe this will be confirmed soon. Until then however, please curb your enthusiasm. Maria Caliban (talk) 21:47, February 11, 2011 (UTC)
- Dream crusher :P VeNiX (talk) 06:37, February 12, 2011 (UTC)
Well we know now who it was they got the first time. Eve Myles. I dont know how much british tv you guys get in the US, but in the UK and, to a lesser extent, here in Australia she's mostly known as a main character in the show Torchwood, a dr who spin-off. So for those worried Merrills accent would be annoying you can watch an episode of that to get a taste of it. Personally, im all for her. i can see the aspects of Merrill in her that they were after and hope they show more of Merrill in the future. her and anders at easy, since they havent shown much of either. Thoughts about the choice?--Ironreaper (talk) 03:01, February 26, 2011 (UTC)
- I'm an avid Torchwood fan so my opinion is obvious, the best VA choice in the entire DA2 cast, period. VeNiX (talk) 20:49, February 26, 2011 (UTC)
- Phew. I was concerned that Bioware would pick someone who would do a terrible impersonation of a Welsh accent like that guy in Red Dead Redemption. As an actual Welshman, I could pick out the horrific swinging between regional variations in every sentence that guy spoke. If they've got someone who actually has a Welsh accent, I'll be able to listen to her talk without cringing.--220.127.116.11 (talk) 20:48, March 1, 2011 (UTC)
Little cute Merrill *3* Edit
Maybe I'm not right, but in the Dragon Age II she became so... cuuute!!! Really kawaii~~ I think she is more better than that upstart Isabella >,< She is the best woman for Hawke!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lady Aurica (talk • contribs) 07:19, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
Go back to Gaia and stay there.
This is why I never tell people that I like anime/manga. They might associate me with creatures like this one. I move to delete this irrelevant inanity for the sake of wiki hygiene. 18.104.22.168 (talk) 00:20, March 7, 2011 (UTC)
- Let's not drag this out any longer. This an old comment. --D. (talk · contr) 19:04, June 12, 2011 (UTC)
Merril joining your party Edit
I'm getting antsy only having a day until release and I started thing is the the possible reason why Merril joins your party is because the ritual you are supposed to perform a virgin sacrifice? Any thoughts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 21:06, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
Wait, she's a companion. You think that the big twist is she's a virgin sacrifice, and what, she comes back from the Fade as a zombie mage? Too close to Anders and Wynne, for one. Or you think she is sacrificing someone else? Not the type. What made you jump to virgin sacrifice? Denevari (talk) 00:04, March 8, 2011 (UTC)
Required Level of Friendship?Edit
I read on her page that her friendship level has to be at a certain amount in order for her to not turn on you when you enter the fade, so can anyone give me a idea how close to the blue icon I need to be before I take her? —Preceding unsigned comment added by J Shepard (talk • contribs) 12:47, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
I don't recall exactly but I had near full friendship with her and she still turned. Also just to add but you don't get an automatic 10 rivalry for taking her in or leaving her out. This is dependent on if you agree to make Feyn'riel tranquil or not before going in. Saying no yields no rivalry gain and, if I remember right, a friendship bonus. This was with a party setup of Aveline, Merrill, and Anders. 126.96.36.199 (talk) 08:13, March 12, 2011 (UTC)
- Actually, it depends on how you talk to Anders when you first arrive. If you say "Justice, I presume," she gives you 10 Rivarly. She tends to get mad at you when you are short with demons. I accepted the responsibility to kill Feynriel if need be, but managed to not get any rivalry EXCEPT for when she accepted the demon's offer. 188.8.131.52 (talk) 00:18, March 13, 2011 (UTC)
- Sorry, correcting myself. It seems like both are at work. If you say no to the tranquil request, AND you use an answer other than "Justice, I presume," you get +5 upon entering the save. Combined with the +15 you can get in her apology later, and that makes the entire quest a wash. 184.108.40.206 (talk) 04:54, March 13, 2011 (UTC)
Companion Quest Edit
Dumtidumtidum SPOILERS! WATCH OUT! Err, ops. I killed her entire clan. :D Apparently the keeper trapped the demon (that could help Merrill repair the mirror) inside of herself. Thus we had to kill her. Then her clan came and was like "We smell blooood!" and I was like "Nu-uh!" and they were like "YOU GUNNA DIE FLAT EARED BITCH!" and I was like "NU-UH!" and gently forced an axe into their brain. Not only did I get to kill a huge Pride Demon, I got to kill (almost) an entire clan of elves! Also, Merrill is very sad. All in all, a very good day. Perez Escuda (talk) 01:08, March 12, 2011 (UTC)
Act 2 Bug Edit
If anyone finds a solution to the bug in the beginning of Act 2 where her initial quest is automatically completed, I'd like them to post it. I can't access the conversation you're apparently supposed to have with her, in the "Mourning" quest. 220.127.116.11 (talk) 12:25, March 12, 2011 (UTC)
- If it helps at all, I've got this bug too, first play through (both as male hawke mage), Carver wasn't taken to the Deep Roads and I was able to access "Mourning" just fine. Second play through, which is sitting on act 2 till, with any luck, there's a fix, Carver was brought to the deep roads and joined the Grey Wardens. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 09:42, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
I just discovered Merrill is unable to heal, upon opening up her Abilities screen for the first time. This puts a huge kink in all my party plans, and it should maybe be mentioned somewhere? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 00:13, 15 March 2011 (UTC)
Second "Questioning Beliefs?" Edit
Is Merrill supposed to have another QB after A New Path? Since everyone else seems to have one after their Act III quest, I'm worried that the A New Path bug is preventing it from occurring. I'm in a romance with her, if that makes any difference. Centerflag982 (talk) 23:17, March 18, 2011 (UTC)
- The "questioning beliefs" after A New Path is called "Mourning" instead of the usual Questioning Beliefs. Assuming you don't hit the bug where Mourning occurs BEFORE A New Path (and confuses the heck out of you).—ErzengelLichtes (Contribs) 08:08, March 29, 2011 (UTC)
Night Terrors start Edit
Merrill does lose some approval upon entering the Fade during the Night Terrors quest BUT unless you press F9 and load an autosave. I did so and had no initial approval drop. SkyBon (talk) 11:26, March 20, 2011 (UTC)
ahh, crap... Edit
Edit to the ending of the New Path Quest Edit
I made an edit specifically saying that the mirror is not seen to be shattered at the end of new path if it's a friendship. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gravothermal (talk • contribs) 18:50, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
Merrill and Ammon Jerro Edit
While reflecting about things, I noticed some uncanny resemblance between Ammon Jerro from Neverwinter Nights 2 and its expansion and Merrill from dragon age 2.
- Both resort to forbidden magic in order to achieve their goals ( Healing the eluvian; Defeating the king of shadows (Ammon was a wizard before he became a warlock- for those who don't know, a warlock is an arcane caster which tap their powers from sealings with Demons, Devils, Fey, Abominations, and other vile creatures, much like blood magic is learnt from demons ( it also has similar effects to blood magic, their users are more resilient than normal mages, can extend their lifetimes for several centuries, can control enemies through their magic (though most other mages also do that on D&D), and aren't bound to their energy/ uses per day))
- Both were on prominent positions in their societies, but felt out of place (Marethari's first; Court Wizard)
- Both end up destroying that which they tried to protect (Merrill: her clan; Ammon: the people of west harbor)
- Both end up killing, directly or indirectly, that which they most loved (Marethari for Merrill, Shandra for Ammon)
- Both can end up remorseful from their actions (Shattering the eluvian; Paying respects on Shandra's farm)
- Both end up joining the main character at the end of their quests, depending on which side they choose ( Mages, Crusaders)
- Both are confronted by evils they contacted in order to obtain their powers ( Pride demon for Merrill; Koraboros, a pit fiend for Ammon (Also, as a side note, pit fiends and pride demons have so much in common, being the most powerful types of regular fiends, looking scaly and red, and having low-pitched voices that echo))
- And lastly, both wear facial tattoos, which are bound to the societies they frequented ( Dalish, Red Wizards).
- Dragon Age II is from BioWare, Neverwinter Nights 2 is from Obsidian. Pride demons are purple, covered in a carapace (doesn't look like scales to me). Mictlantecuhtli (talk) 19:15, May 25, 2011 (UTC)
While I thought it was the default style for all elven females in DA2, its specualtion only at this point. Until someone can test the default appearance of elven females with no clothing equipped it doesn't belong in the trivia sections. Mictlantecuhtli (talk) 19:15, May 25, 2011 (UTC)
Merrill Article Clean-Up Edit
Ok, I think I got overzealous on improving the article about Merrill. I'll just move the quotes I added to the Merrill/Dialogue section. In case I encounter more lines, I'll put them there instead. I'll also modify every gender-specific pronoun on the whole page, unless it pertains to a certain character, such as Merrill herself.
- You can select whichever quotes you believe should be featured. :] Thanks for the help! --D. (talk · contr) 16:30, June 18, 2011 (UTC)
- I'm done spring cleaning Merrill's article. I already removed the cleanup tag. Please inspect. I hope it meets the standards of the wiki.
- As for most of the quotes I omitted, I cut-pasted them on Notepad, then saved. I'll be posting it on the Merrill/Dialogue at another time.
- There's still some things that need to be edited, but the article has definitely improved.
- Since this kind of page is not a walkthrough (except some obvious sections that are for gameplay), some rewording should be done to improve the flow and neutrality of the article. Character pages should read like an encyclopaedic articles, without the need to refer to "this quest" for example. There's still some formatting issues, but these will be addressed later (and possibly on the forums, especially in regards to the friendship/rivalry sections).
- Quotes are saved in the article history, so there's no worries about losing anything.
- I'll have another go on the Involvement section then. I'll either remove or change phrases then link them to other pages, for the "quests".
- Done on further improvements to the Involvement section. I see the flow of her story now, I hope you do too! As I have mentioned, I'll just post the quotes on Merrill/Dialogue another time, and I'll organize them.
- Looking good!
- There were some criticism about suggesting how Merrill feels about certain events since these are speculations(and thus subject to changes on how the editor feels about it). Ideally, it should be left ambiguous (or just sticking to the facts) so users can decide on themselves. --D. (talk · contr) 16:02, June 20, 2011 (UTC)
- I've now encoded new information on the Merrill/Dialogue page. I'll just add more when I start my fourth playthrough. I saw the forum Approval guides that you posted. Maybe... just MAYBE, I'll work on that, too!
- It's because I (one of us) am a Merrill fan, LOL.
What's up with Merrill's dramatic personality change. In DA Origins I could tell she was kind of a lone wolf, but she wasn't really shy. She spoke her mind. When I brought an elf to help me find Tamlen she was like "Did you really think I wouldn't notice you brought someone with you?" So I am just curious as to why she changed so much. Perhaps discovering blood magice changed her in more than one way. 126.96.36.199 (talk) 02:10, July 3, 2011 (UTC)
- I think the point was that Merrill is more uncomfortable around total strangers, as opposed to her own people. The general idea seems to be that Merrill is dealing with culture shock in a society that is completely foreign to her, as a Dalish elf. And I'm glad that we had at least one sane blood mage, in a sea of insane and stupid mage antagonists that often made little to no sense (since I don't see how Decimus could confuse someone like Merrill for a templar). Lobsel Vith (talk) 00:21, February 5, 2013 (UTC)
- Also, comparing her Origins personality isn't that productive unless
- BioWare is on record as having planned back then to use her in a future DA installment, or having carefully considered 'matching her up' with her prior incarnation (which they arguably barely did in the visual sense alone).
- and/or as Lobsel Vith points out, in the Dalish Origin she is among her people before the full implications of a Blight (and the trouble with nearby humans) has been realized; even if a Dalish Warden does everything possible to support a 'brighter future' for the Marethari, M. wasn't likely to come through the Blight with a completely unchanged attitude.Yeti magi (talk) 16:35, February 5, 2013 (UTC)
Merrill - Original Concept Art Edit
I checked the official PDF game guide and all characters are depicted as they were initially planned in the original concept.
Bethany - short blond hair, god no. Cassandra - long hair - mmmm, good. Merrill - apparently, her's was a more darker look, at least the way her hair and expression was, it screamed more dark, threatening, though, violent, bit brooding. Too bad they didn't go with that, she'd be more interesting as a romance option. Her cuteness is hilarious, though. But, other than that, potential abomination.
Is it possible for Merrill to die in Act 3? Edit
I just got to the decision between Templars and Mages in Act 3, and I didn't do any of Merrill's side quests, nor did I have a rivalry or friendship with her. I talked to her in her house a few times early on, but that's it. She still did not attack when I sided with the Templars, so I'm wondering if it's possible for her not to follow Hawke at all... Fritzywiggins (talk) 23:18, September 10, 2011 (UTC)
Actually it does seem in fact she can be killed during the Battle if you side against her as I have not been on my Dragon Age 2 for some time I cant remember how but I know that there are several videos on youtube —Riley Heligo 22:02, October 29, 2011 (UTC)
You can kill Merrill, but you must have 100% rivalry with Anders and must not complete her last personal quest. In this case she will turn on a pro-templar Hawke in the Gallows and can be killed. /watch?v=SQINllZMWcg, /watch?v=O8WiAhZNsQk or /watch?v=xv-iYMItc7s for a confirmation. Asherinka (talk) 17:40, January 25, 2012 (UTC)
@ NicKeL BreaD - Re last edits:
- 1. Fate: I would agree that it is a bit excessive
- 2. Style (story vs walkthrough): I would agree but it does not mean that you should exclude the information on how she behaves during the Last Straw completely. I've added it back but edited it to match the style of the rest of the article. Hope it works.
- PS1 I do not know how to explain why Anders must have 100% rivalry & his quest completed lorewise. It has to deal with the gameplay: one mage other than the sibling always sides with a pro-templar Hawke just like one warrior always sides with a pro-mage Hawke. Merrill turns on Hawke only if Anders may potentially join the party (hence the two conditions mentioned above). However the player can indeed kill them both in this case. I strongly advocate for including this information in the article because it is a Wiki and it must include all outcomes even if they are dictated by the gameplay rather than the story.
- May be (may be) one can rationalize that Merrill (or Aveline) stays with Hawke because she feels ashamed of Anders (or Fenris) leaving Hawke, and if he does not, she feels free to leave herself, I don't know. Anyway, it's a speculation. IMHO the best thing we can do is just mention the fact as it is - without any interpretation.
- PS2 Having not completed the quest is the requirement, friendship/rivalry (and thus 'trust' in the story) has nothing to do with her reactions at this point. You may have 100% friendship and a romance with Merrill, but you will still have the option to kill her if you are pro-templar as long as the last quest has not been done and.. re Anders see above. Again, may be one can rationalize that her attitude towards Hawke is messed up after the encounter at the Pride's End unless Hawke talks to her this last time.
- 3. Romance & death: My wording is correct, please leave it be. You can always convince Merrill to side with you in the Gallows courtyard. The player (if we write a walkthrough) or Hawke (if we write a story) must want to kill her and choose aggressive replies for her to die. You don't have to kill her, but it is rather an option and as a version of the story it qualifies to be included in the article. However disturbing such choice is :)
- PS It is also correct for Bethany who is a Circle mage. You can choose to allow Meredith to kill her but you do not have to. Asherinka (talk) 04:40, January 27, 2012 (UTC)
- I suggest that the walkthrough portion to romancing her, including options and mechanics including bugs, to be moved under "Merrill/Romance", like we do for approval. We also do it for Leliana (Leliana/Romance). --D. (talk · contr) 18:44, January 28, 2012 (UTC)
Edit War Edit
@ NicKeL BreaD "Fate is no longer needed; Involvement shares the same purpose. Romance and Involvement are written as stories, not detailed walkthroughs" "There should be no tips or quantitative data; this is a synopsis, not a walkthrough."
- 1. I see no reason why we should not mention under what conditions this character behaves in certain ways.
- 2. I wrote a story. All versions of the story. Including the one in which she dies. It seems to me that the only reason you keep deleting the fragment is that you simply don't like the fact that such story also may take place. I would kindly ask you to stop deleting it and to edit it if you think that something is wrong with the style, but to retain all the information.
Tattoo Changes Edit
I just noticed that her tattoos changed from DAO to DAII. Is it worth noting in the article that her face paint was changed or retconned since the events of Origins?
From DAO to DAll Edit
About the romance in DA2 Edit
I romanced Merril through the whole game, and nobody else. I had maximum friendship with her, I had the "love" scene with her and all, and in the epilogue, Varric says she stayed with me. Still, even tough I got the "flirtatious" achievement, I didn't get the "romantic" one. Why?--188.8.131.52 (talk) 01:21, June 18, 2012 (UTC)
- Well being named is not enough. I think a paragraph dedicated to that particular demon in the Pride demon page is enough. Also the page "Audacity" to link to that paragraph. 16:28, August 14, 2013 (UTC)
- http://www.ladyinsanity.com/archive/notes-on-bioware-pax-east – mostlyautumn • talk • contribs • 08:47, January 22, 2015 (UTC)