Talk: A Paragon of Her Kind

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Asunder Edit

The page says you get a nice reward. However, when I did the quest I chose to kill the Fade Beast and got no reward at all. Google tells me that if you leave him alone he gives you 25 gold. Has anyone gotten any reward for killing him? Sheltim 15:36, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

I believe I got some items, and potions. Can't for the life of me remember WHAT they were, though. I did continue on the save where I killed the beast, so it must have been worth the loss of 25 gold. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.125.251.241 (talk) 23:59, November 15, 2009‎ (UTC)

I've gotten some items including armour at times and at other times nothing. I think like a lot of things (Jammer's Stash included) the rewards vary. --MiyuEmi 13:30, November 26, 2009 (UTC)

Kill = Exprience (~115 EXP points) + a few random items

Free = No Exp + 25Gold —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.192.74.56 (talk) 22:47, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Related quests... Edit

This is linked from the main Walkthrough as being the section about Orzammar, but... it's extremely lacking regarding early parts of the Orzammar quest. (For example, siding with one of the candidates for king...) I haven't finished Orzammar yet (inside the Carta Hideout) so I admit that I was a bit confused as to the progression of the entire quest. So, my question is: What is the name of the quest that Alistair gives you relating to Orzammar? (would check myself if I were at home.) If it IS "Paragon of her Kind," I do think we need links to to the appropriate "siding with Behlen/Harrowmont" sections. If it's NOT "Paragon of her Kind," we need to relink the main Walkthrough to the appropriate section. One that also lists the sidequests that open up, and when they can be taken care of, etc. etc, like Broken Circle and Nature of the Beast do. And if I'm being completely thick, point me to the appropriate sections so I can be ashamed. - Ancestralmask 16:40, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

I'll try and add some more information specifically about supporting the two candidates. Also, I'll throw in some of the sidequests I've found in Orzammar, although I can't really promise much as far as the actual quest order goes since I have an endgame save I use to browse through the Journal, which doesn't help quest order any. I won't resection the whole page or anything; I'll let someone else who has worked on some of the other walkthroughs to do that. Pwr905 16:51, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll take a look at it when I get home later, and I can compare it to my save file. Although I'm absolutely hating Orzammar right now, because there are far too many load screens and my computer is absolutely not liking it. Maybe I should play it on the 360 for walkthrough-making purposes... Incidentally, I think the Bhelen and Harrowmont pages might have information regarding their quests, or at least link to other sections -- I'm pretty sure I saw at least one of those parts actually written out well, so you could just link to that. - Ancestralmask 17:05, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

Alrighty ... added a few things. There's a lot more, obviously ... but it should be a decent start. Some of those 'A Prince's Favor'/'A Lord's Trust' might wind up with their own page? dunno. I'll add a few more things as they come to me - maybe take a screenshot and try to figure out how to do that whole thing, as we don't seem to have a Commons' picture. Pwr905 17:52, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

Thank you! :) ... okay, I knew I'd seen a "detailed" walkthrough somewhere. A New King for Orzammar. It's... not over detailed about the specifics of the first part of the quest... Should we merge it over to here? Since essentially, it's a collection of small quests (The Prince's/Lord's favor ones)... hmm. - Ancestralmask 18:00, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

(out)Just so I'm understanding you correctly, you mean merge A New King for Orzammar into A Paragon of Her Kind? Reason I ask, is I'm not sure if "A New King for Orzammar" is an actual name of anything in the game (read: no quest with that name). Either way, the direction of the merge is moot, I suppose; to your original point, yeah, I don't think we're doing anyone any good with both pages floating around. Pwr905 18:11, November 25, 2009 (UTC)

Honestly, when I first found DA:O wikia, I had trouble finding information on each particular part of this quest, as I would search for the starting quest names and come up with null. In my opinion, it's doing less good with it's current article name being that of a quest that only appears after you've figured out half of how to get there and almost completed Orzammar, in my opinion. If it would please everyone to have a long Orzammar quest walkthrough, atleast name it one of the earlier quests so it's easier to find. Without realizing, I've already made a page (see Entering Jarvia's Hideout) which covers parts of it, although I didn't realize A Paragon of Her Kind had already breezed over some of the necessary information (albeit little). I propose, if there is to be one giant walkthrough, that it be named a bit more appropriately for user-friendliness, and if not, link to appropriate quest walkthroughs. --AugustusBlade 20:42, November 28, 2009 (UTC)

I can see where you're coming from -- I had the same issue at first. The easiest way to access it is through the Walkthrough page, but, of course, if you're only doing a search for the quest itself... However, this is the name of the quest that Alistair gives you at the beginning, so there's really no other "all-encompassing" name we could give it. What we CAN do is make sure all the detailed quest pages (if we have those?) have links back to this main one. I'll see what I can do. - Ancestralmask 14:26, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

I appreciate it. However, I have made a more detailed quest page regarding the 2nd task given by Bhelen/Harrowmont. I will make sure to mention that it's part of the Paragon of her Kind quest. --AugustusBlade 05:22, December 1, 2009 (UTC)

Okay, I added a link to that and I've made (still red) links to the starting quests of the candidates. I'll try to flesh those out, so that people can find everything properly. - Ancestralmask 14:14, December 1, 2009 (UTC)

Dead Legion Edit

The name of the individual you fight with after activating this statue is lost to me at the moment! I will update this once I have taken a look at the guide or my memory is kicked into action by way of caffeine! --MiyuEmi 09:07, November 26, 2009 (UTC)

Oh hooray for Caffeine!!! God I wish I had some.. Work is killing me tonight. --Crackerjaquebox 13:56, November 26, 2009 (UTC)

Optional Oghren? Edit

I've never had a choice as to whether or not to bring Oghren into the Deep Roads. He always shows up as a 'set companion' like Wynne in the Broken Circle quest. Can anyone confirm for me that you are actually allowed to take Oghren out of your party when entering the Deep Roads? Thanks. --MiyuEmi 09:45, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

I only own the PC version so I can only speak for that - on that it doesn't lock him into your party when he first shows up as your leaving the Commons; it only does that post-broodmother in the Anvil. Pwr905 09:59, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

[Xbox 360 version] I'm doing this part now (second time through) and Oghren is OPTIONAL for me. First time through he was either not optional, or I just thought he wasn't and added him to my party like a good little sheep. FYI Shale does not have to be in your party for the Deep Roads quest, so you can just swap the dwarf for the golem if you have her in your party. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.1.204.87 (talk) 23:16, January 8, 2010 (UTC)

Of Noble Blood Edit

I've corrected the information between of Noble Blood and Lost to the Memories. Unfortunately I can't think of the dwarven woman's name off the top of my head. It's an M name and I'll insert it after viewing my guidebook at home!! Thanks. --MiyuEmi 08:29, December 7, 2009 (UTC)

Ancient Darkspawn Edit

I'm not sure what it's like on the console, but I know this for fact on PC. If you haven't found the "Honorable Topsider's" sarcophagus while exploring, he will not spawn. You can have the other two pieces to the sword, but until you've actually gotten the quest from the Sarcophagus the Ancient Darkspawn will not Spawn in that annoying tunnel to drop the blade to the sword. In fact, considering the absolute nightmare this tunnel can be, I'd almost recommend skipping the casket until you've cleared the group before the Ancient Darkspawn. That stupid emissary will retreat back to him, but if he's not there, the fight is so much easier. Then you can come back and face him solo, which makes beatin him butter. Again, this is for the PC, I don't know if there's a group before his encounter on console. Tough fight in it's own right. There's an emissary that hangs out in the back and everytime you get close, he runs further up the tunnel, spawning more corrupted spiders as he goes. Finally, culminating in bringing the Ancient at you if you've already found the coffin. --Crackerjaquebox 13:15, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

I know on my first playthrough I hadn't found the coffin, but I still ended up fighting the Ancient Darkspawn. He surprised the crap out of me too the first time. At least now I'm ready for him. I always have Shale in my party, Zevran using a bow and me with Ranger learned spawning a great bear. You're right though, the corridor is so claustrophobic that it's easy to lose your bearings in there with so much going on. --MiyuEmi 14:14, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

I don't know, I see this in here again about the Ancient Darkspawn only spawning if you've found the sarcophygi and I'm not sure about that. I don't remember ever finding it the first time. I ended up with a bunch of sword pieces and no idea what to do with them, but he still spawned. I play on the XBox 360, I wonder if theres a difference between it and the PC version. --MiyuEmi 21:47, December 14, 2009 (UTC)

finding the prince Edit

Um...I need a bit of help here. I sided with the prince guy whose name I starts with a b. I delivered the house sale records and kill the carta but I can't find the prince to "tell him the good news". I've searched everywhere, even a hint will be helpful.--209.208.106.233 00:27, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

I believe you can find him back at the royal palace in the Diamond Quarter. Good luck! Loleil 00:52, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

You have to talk to his henchman in the Assembly after you've completed both tasks. He will bring you to Bhelen.Exyll 19:53, December 11, 2009 (UTC)

I broke this quest Edit

Trying to play both side of the political fence up to the last minute went sour for me. I started supporting Bhelen all the way (got both signatures), then at the last minute I entered the proving grounds for Harrowmont. This pissed off Bhelen, but, so far I had been getting exp for playing both sides. So I enter AotV, kill Caridin, and get the crown made, give it to Harrowmont (just to spite Bhelen). Bhelen does his outburst, Harrowmont gets crowned...but: 1-I now have Dwarves supporting me (instead of golems) 2-Harrowmont wears the crown in Orzammar, yet Paragon of her Kind is still active in my queue... I went back to Branka, she's just lost in Anvil talk... Everything else is still working as intended, the Landsmeet is about to begin so it seems no harm is done but just having that 'incomplete quest' scar on my char is ugly. So when entering Orzammar: Pick a side and stick with it!Exyll 19:50, December 11, 2009 (UTC)

---

Case 2. Here is my story. My apology of messy order and spoiler.

1. "A Prince's Favor:The First Task" (Accepted both quests but finished with this one.)

2. "Shifting Allegiances" (Before talked to Vartag, I went to Dublin at Tapster's Tavern to activate this quest)

3. "A Prince's Favor:The Second Task" (This quest was received from Bhelen, but at the cutscene with Jarvia, she mentioned Harrowmont not Bhelen. Maybe "Shifting Allegiances" affected with this.)

Looted the evidence and handed it to Dublin. And met Harrowmont and received a Branka quest(4-1).

After this, I went to Bheln and had last task(4-2).

(Bhelen) What do u know about Paragon Branka? 5.Harrowmont asked me the same thing.

(Bhelen) ....Which of us will you serve? 4.(Lie)I will ask her to help you."

4. "Paragon of Her Kind" for Harrowmont & "Paragon of Her kind" for Bhelen. (Helped Cardin and killed Branka.)

When I gave the crown to Harrowmont, one of PHK quests remain in journal. Lots of people has same problem and I can't fix this with debug mode. Plot jump can't deal with this problem.

HOWEVER, when I gave the crown to Bhelen. All of PHK quests are shown as completed. This might be why I wrote this long article. WHY!!

In conclusion, Do not play both side on the last requests related to Branka. A player has option to not to help one of them in dialogue.--Jkcloud 07:51, December 20, 2009 (UTC)

Delay the decision to pick sides? Edit

The article says "The decision of who to support can be delayed until the very end, after returning from the Anvil of the Void." What is meant by this? If there is some way to open access to the deep roads without performing a quest for one candidate or the other the article makes no mention of it elsewhere. Is it possible to skip to the 'Enter the Deep Roads' part of the quest without performing the other tasks? Tetracycloide 20:07, December 19, 2009 (UTC)

If I remember correctly, you can choose to switch sides afterwards. Though considering the reliability of my memory, somebody may wish to verify this... --vom 20:21, December 19, 2009 (UTC)

verified for you :) once you have the crown and are back in orzammar THEN you can change ur decision (e.g. support bhelen then crow harrowmont) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.55.206.19 (talk) 07:19, January 6, 2010 (UTC)

It's also possible to switch sides (at least from Bhelen to Harrowmont) after completing the first quest. See Shifting Allegiances for a new article aiming to detail this possibility. ♦ Zoev ^talk 20:14, January 30, 2010 (UTC)

Approval Notes Edit

This is the first time I've sided with Branka on this quest and before I edit the approval notes, I wanted to double check: I tried (I think) all the dialogue tree options and the ONLY time I lost approval from Oghren was when Branka initially asks me about what I want and I choose the 'Make Oghren a golem' option (which got me -13). Every other choice, including any where I persuade Branka to destroy the anvil got me +7 approval from Oghren. Fritti Tailchaser 13:52, December 27, 2009 (UTC)

Strategy Edit

The strategy section for Anvil of the Void was starting to get rather leggy, so I've moved it here. --vom 12:08, January 9, 2010 (UTC)

Shale's Crisis Moment? Edit

This Page Said That This Is Shale's "Crisis Moment". What Exactly Is This?Coroxn 10:10, January 12, 2010 (UTC)

All companions have a crisis moment, a moment during which you risk losing them as companions based on a choice that you make ie if you are not friendly enough with Zevran, his 'crisis moment' occurs when your group is confronted by Tailsen. If Zevran isn't friendly enough with you, he will turn on you and leave the party for good through death in that battle. Alistair will leave the party without question if you recruit the secret companion etc. The only party member who will never leave the team, as far as I'm aware is Dog. Dog will always remain with you. --MiyuEmi 11:10, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

Becoming king if you're a noble dwarf Edit

Hi!

I've read on a discussion board, that you could become king of the dwarfs if you were of noble dwarf origin.

However, I couldn't find any information on the wiki about it. If I haven't look closely and it's there: Maybe it's worth a headline? If not: could someone who played noble dwarf implement it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.230.34.166 (talk) 10:55, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

Unless someone corrects me I'm pretty sure you cannot become King of Orzammar, regardless of whether or not you are a Dwarven Noble. I only know that you can become a Paragon if you are a dwarf, but beyond that, I think King is strictly for either Harrowmount of Bhelan. --MiyuEmi 11:08, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

When you become a Warden, you forfeit your rights to own land and have any title.

Kai A. Stensson (talk) 21:28, August 24, 2010 (UTC)

That's not true at all Kai. Alistar and Noble humans can become royalty, City Elfs can become Banns, and Vigil's Keep and the surrounding lands are essentially the bannorn of the Warden Commander.--8.24.104.75 (talk) 00:28, March 6, 2011 (UTC)

Talking to Bhelen immediately - Dwarf Noble Edit

This article claims that a dwarf noble can talk to Bhelen immediately (ie without completing A Prince's Favor: The First Task). I don't seem to be able to get this working in game. Is anyone able to confirm that it is possible, and, if so, what dialogue choices are required or what else needs doing? Thanks! ♦ Zoev ^talk 20:12, January 30, 2010 (UTC)

Oghren approval Edit

I just encountered kinda weird situation. I've sided with golems, i.e. killed Branka nananana, and... I got +7 from Oghren. He said something like "She'd found what she deserved" and bah: approval. A bug maybe? Or specific story line (obviously, I've allowed him to choose his reward)? Pan Tumnus 01:58, February 9, 2010 (UTC)

I had a different problem with Oghren's approval. No matter what dialogue options I chose when siding with Branka/Caradin he never tried to convince me to side with Branka and only gave +4 approval. Could this be because both Zevran and Morrigan were in the party and tried to convince me to side with Branka?--CouslandRogue (talk) 03:10, June 24, 2013 (UTC)

Trian's Maul Not Acquired Edit

I finished the Quest and decide to crown Bhelen (following all his tasks). After the crowning, I was only rewarded an Aeducan Mace which is some Grey Iron carp. Should there be a specific way of supporting Bhelen in order to acquirethe said weapon instead? Alpha Ariestis (talk) 13:53, June 14, 2010 (UTC)

Yes do not enter the proving fights from the Proving Master. If you do not fight in them Bhelen gives you the maul. Otherwise it will be the mace. --Tsavi (talk) 17:19, January 25, 2011 (UTC)

Repeating conversation bug in Throne Room Edit

I encountered a weird bug after choosing Harrowmont to wear the Paragon-made crown: A conversation occurs, where Bhelen gets pissed. He attacks. Combat occurs. After I kill him, the "you win" conversation is supposed to play, but instead, the "Bhelen is pissed" conversation plays AGAIN. He stands back up, yells, and then dies again. THEN the correct conversation occurs. This has occured on every one of my play-throughs when choosing Harrowmont.

However, I had one of particular note: When killing Bhelen, my character did a flourish that removed his head. When the previous conversation re-occurs, Bhelen is standing there angry WITH NO HEAD. Maclimes (talk) 23:38, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

Branka quadruplication Edit

>> Bug:Sometimes when siding with Caridin, Branka will somehow duplicate into as many as four Elite enemies, making the battle very difficult.

I believe that this is not a bug. I fought this fight 3 times and every time Branka did her thing when her health bar reached half. Also - the copies are not fully corporeal and will will disappear when they take some damage (not sure how many, but I would estimate 1/10 of the full health bar) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.160.122.78 (talk) 22:43, January 9, 2011 (UTC)

Indeed, it is not (it's marked as such in the toolset). I've removed it. --D. (talk · contr) 16:54, January 10, 2011 (UTC)

Spiders :( Edit

Okay, I know this might sound lame, but when the spiders come down from the ceilings in other quests involving them, it scares me shitless. So I would just like to know if there is any of that in this quest. XSpectreGreyX (talk) 01:10, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

Not stupid at all, and I have the same issue, I have a MAJOR bug phobia IRL. I can handle them normally but when they drop down it really freaks me out. Thankfully, I bound a key to god mode enable/disable and I just hit it when the spiders appear and leave the room for a while, they're all dead when I return. As to your question, yes, there are MANY during the portion in the tunnels. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chuckmoney (talk • contribs) 19:39, February 21, 2011‎

No party choice screen Edit

"There will be a final opportunity to choose your party, so choose accordingly."

I relied on this statement and did not put Shale in my party, then did not get an option to add her at any point during the Anvil of the Void map. I went back to Orzammar and then traveled directly to Anvil of the Void (and got locked in, as expected). I thought I remembered getting a party-choice-screen either before meeting Branka or before meeting Caridin. This playthrough, I *did* have Oghren in my party for all of the deep roads content. Is it because I had him in the party already that a party change was not triggered (when he complains and wants to join up)?

If that's correct, should the above quoted statement be amended? Was it intended to say "will not"? (Seems oddly worded to begin with, stating that you get an opportunity and then warning you to choose accordingly.) I, for one, really didn't feel like replaying the entire trap level (aka Anvil of the Void) just to hear Shale's dialogue...but I would have added her at the start if I had known better. mel 68.112.202.234 (talk) 02:13, April 14, 2014 (UTC)

You're right, it was wrongly stated. I have now made some tweaks on the description. I hope they are to your liking. 06:25, April 14, 2014 (UTC)

Figor's Shop Edit

The article says "Killing the Carta will get you the key". Working for Harrowmont, there was no key regardless of when the thugs were killed - before and after getting the Jarvia task, or before and after learning about the key (fingerbone token) from Nadezda. Playing on PC v1.05. KnightOwl42 (talk) 12:09, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

This is indeed inaccurate. Fixed. 12:49, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Must've missed it Edit

"Siding with Caridin gives the Warden an option to ask for an additional reward (Master Lightning Rune) if Oghren is not allowed to ask for a reward in order to gain influence"

Hmmm just sided with Caridin and didn't spot the option that led to request :-(

Ah never mind. It turns out the first thing I tried had worked, one is just not given any immediate confirmation so you don't know. For those interested, "I'll thank you for anything your skill can add to my cause" gives you something after you've vandalised the anvil.

Speaking of which an I the only one who thinks it strange that it can stand up to normal hammer blows from a paragon smith, but along comes a, slight of frame, female elf mage, who, with one blow, finds the weak spot and destroys it ?

Side with Branka? Edit

So guys, should I side with Branka or not? Also, can you give me some tips (who to pick to fight, tactics or moves)?

Thanks

Siding with Branka gets you Golems to use during the final battle which are far and away the best army you get. Also you get Oghren's support too. Combat wise the boss fight is inverted. Siding with Branka you fight caridin and 4 golems and 2 golem allies, while siding with caridin you fight branka and 4 golems with 2 golem allies. Branka's defense is crazy high though so its not really any easier. I suggest using healing aura to keep your own golems alive as long as possible (they're the ones with the green health bar), you can also use the heal spell if you target them. This will help take a lot of heat off your party. Story wise supporting branka and letting her restore the anvil opens up more dialogue, ambient dialogue and narrative possibilities later too.

Also the talk page is really intended more for discussion of the article, for stuff like this you're better off using the forums.

-HD3 ^(Talk) 15:05, April 19, 2015 (UTC)

Harrowmont's "support" rating Edit

I'm not sure how accurate the part of the article where it talks about how much support you need for the size of Bhelen's supporting group to be reduced. I convinced both of Harrowmont's fighters to re-enter the Proving (+2), I dedicated my victory to Harrowmont and fought for him to begin with (+2), I killed Jarvia (+3). This gives Harrowmont a support rating of +7, but despite this half the room turned hostile in the Assembly, which seems considerably more than "just a small group of Bhelen supporters", is there anything I've missed?--Notso (talk) 15:10, October 12, 2015 (UTC)