Well, I just finished Asunder. Good story if you can get through Gaider's sometimes tedious writing and bad proofreading. I loved all the characters, even Lambert, he was nice and hateable. I really liked Adrian too, her anger made her very endearing to me.. And though I don't hate her for what she did at the end, it did leave a bad taste in my mouth.
Shale, well, Shale is Shale, what more could you ask for.
Evangeline is a great character, obviously I'm no fan of Templars, but she's a good person. Willing to cast aside the demands of her order when she knows that it's not right. Her father raised her well.
Wynne was consistent with the way she was in Origins, though Rhys seemed to disagree with that sentiment. She was interesting to follow around through the whole book, especially her fight in the fade. And then the way she finally died, I felt sad, like I lost a friend or something. Afterall, up until my computer broke I was playing Origins+Awakening+II on repeat constantly since all three came out. Sucked to see her go, but at least she got closure as a character and left in a good way.
Rhys is just plain awesome. One of my favorite characters throughout the series so far. And as far as book protagonists go, I do like him a bit more than Maric, but maybe not adolescent Duncan.
Also, Fiona returns in all her awesomeness. "Fuck the Divine."
So now.. Question time. What exactly is Cole? Judging by the epilogue, it seems like he's the soul of a lost would-be apprentice that was somehow over taken by a demon? Why did he hear the Archdemon's call in the badlands (did I miss something? do demons hear it too)? Why did he disappear only to reappear a short time later. And did he kill Lambert?
If he did kill Lambert, is that going to halt the siege on the fortress the mages are held up in?
It said the red staff grabbed in the sewers was one given to her by the Warden, do you think that it was an actual in-game staff? It was red, and apparently full of evil. The only thing I can think of would be the Corrupted Magister's Staff from the Return to Ostagar DLC.
Do you think Evangeline has the spirit that kept Wynne alive inside her now, and if so, what kind of powers do you think it could offer her? Maybe it'd be like the Spirit Warrior specialization from Awakening that, despite being available for all characters, was mostly supposed to reflect Justice's role in Awakening.
Who's on the cover? Cole and Lambert?
Does lyrium offer a high of some kind? The way the mages and Evangeline both reacted to it interested me, and seemed like some kind of coke/crack or meth effect.
And finally, the most important question. What character do you think will have a major role Dragon Age 3? Clearly Cole, at least. Evangeline will probably be there to if they decide to do anything with the spirit thingie.. I have a feeling she'll end up a party member, if not Rhys will. Maybe both. Somehow I doubt both.. But one or the other.
That was long, ramblie, and maybe a little incoherent. OneDeadTemplar (talk) 13:37, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
It is utterly unclear who is Cole, either a soul (we haven't met any before in DA lore) or a spirit of.. Mercy, as someone suggested on BSN. Doing mercy killings, yep) Asherinka (talk) 20:29, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
- I think you're right now that you say that, it makes a lot of sense. It came to Cole in his darkest hour, he was already dead, I guess. But a spirit of Mercy, huh? Logical, if nothing else I guess. I really hope this isn't the last we saw of him.. Or Rhys, or Evangeline. OneDeadTemplar (talk) 20:34, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
- A crazy thought, but I was even wondering if he could be our old friend Justice, who somehow left Anders and forgot his previous experiences. Rhys first sees Cole a year before the main events of Asunder, while Asunder takes place a year after Kirkwall rebellion. Thus Rhys sees Cole shortly after DA2 Act3? It could also explain the Archdemon's thing, the ability to hear him being something the spirit could retain from his previous host. And the way how he is concerned with mages.. Just speculations, though. Asherinka (talk) 20:47, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
- The bit about the Archdemon's call made me wonder for a moment, but I sort of doubt it. Nothing Cole did responded to the idea of Justice. At least not until the very end. A spirit of Mercy sounds more likely, or a spirit of.. friendship or companionship corrupted by the horrible loneliness in Cole and turned into just that, a demon of loneliness or something to that effect.
- Everything about Cole's character reflected those two traits. He was miserable. He was always lonely. He killed people because it made him the most important person in their world, if only for a moment. And Rhys, his only friend.. And he'd do anything for him. Travel through the badlands and risk darkspawn, he got trapped in the Fade and stood up to the Archdemon itself to keep Rhys alive. Cole did that, a scared scared young man that couldn't even look people in the eyes, but if it meant saving his friend, he did it. Then even in the real world, he took on something scarier than the Archdemon itself: Lord Seeker Lambert, he fought him to the death to keep Rhys alive. Loneliness and the desire for a friend was what defined Cole
- Rhys kept implying throughout the book that there we didn't know everything about spirits and demons. Maybe there's more kinds we don't know about. This is a total crack pot theory because there's nothing in the lore about such spirits of demons, but Rhys said to keep your mind open, so I am. OneDeadTemplar (talk) 21:02, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
- He could also really be a ghost.. may be all spirits are in fact ghosts and that is what makes them different from demons? And yes, I basically agree with Rhys when he says that the time has come to admit that we know nothing about ROT, demons and mages' powers. Asherinka (talk) 21:17, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
- A crazy thought, but I was even wondering if he could be our old friend Justice, who somehow left Anders and forgot his previous experiences. Rhys first sees Cole a year before the main events of Asunder, while Asunder takes place a year after Kirkwall rebellion. Thus Rhys sees Cole shortly after DA2 Act3? It could also explain the Archdemon's thing, the ability to hear him being something the spirit could retain from his previous host. And the way how he is concerned with mages.. Just speculations, though. Asherinka (talk) 20:47, January 13, 2012 (UTC)
I kind of believe that Cole is a demon of desire. His(her?) desires where many and varied throughout the book and changed based on the situation. Though I could be mistaken, Cole must have been close to death many years ago and a demon offered him life(possession). Overtime the demon forgot it was a demon at all and became cole- like lambert said about confused spirits... it desired to save those who suffered (because of cole's behaviors) and to remember it was a demon to begin with. I doubt spirits are much more different than living people- besides their main character trait(whatever the spirit/demon's trait is). They seem to behave (normal) as in the case of justice being able to exist without murdering everyone during his zombie phase(haha) ...i guess they are just very opinionated spirit beings- who cant make sense of a world they don't come from... just my opinion. Swampman 04:44, January 14, 2012 (UTC)
The spirits and demons seem to know about as much of the mortal realm as mortals know about theirs. I don't even know that I'd consider the demons evil. They need to feed off something to continue to exist in their form just as we do. They probably look at us the same way we look at farm animals. Also imagine if humans had no names and were just addressed by our main character trait. How many of us would be considered just as bad as some demons are, or worse? The Maker is said in the Chant of Light to have endless pride, what if he's a pride demon? What if all mortal beings are just spirits that possess a host organism and forget who and what they were? The spirits/demons seem to be as intelligent and knowledgeable as mortals (in some different ways) but also like mortals, short tempered with strange creatures.
"Rhys kept implying throughout the book that there we didn't know everything about spirits and demons. Maybe there's more kinds we don't know about. This is a total crack pot theory because there's nothing in the lore about such spirits of demons,"
It's not a crackpot theory at all. If it was in the lore, we'd know it (most likely). How would they record knowledge they didn't have?
"Wynne was consistent with the way she was in Origins, though Rhys seemed to disagree with that sentiment."
Perhaps he was referring to how she has changed since being possessed.
Did Evangeline get Wynne's spirit or the spirit of faith that possessed Wynne?
--Vampire Damian (talk) 07:30, January 14, 2012 (UTC)
- She said she doesn't know, so I assume yes. OneDeadTemplar (talk) 13:38, January 14, 2012 (UTC)
- It’s tough to tell what Cole is, but it seems like he was a real person, probably a mage but I’m not entirely sure, who was left in his cell and forgotten by the templars and thus died. It seemed that a demon or perhaps a spirit came to possess his body and allowed him to live; I’m thinking much like how the spirit of faith came to save Wynne when she had died. The thing possessing Cole said to Lambert that it held his hand in the darkness until it was over (to which I think he died), and was helpless to stop the templars from erasing his records. Would a demon feel bad for not being able to stop templars from erasing his records? As to what really possesses him, a spirit or demon, and what type it is, I’m unsure of, but I do think there is something like that in him. Then, the question of why Rhys couldn’t tell there was a demon/spirit in Cole would be the same as to why he never detected a spirit in Wynne, because I don’t think he did, did he?
- As to why Cole could hear music like that of the calling from an archdemon, I’m not sure at all. It could be that he’s actually hearing the music from lyrium, to which we know a spirit and probably demon can hear, although when he’s heard the music, there wasn’t an indication that there was lyrium nearby. However, the Veil was very thin where he was in Adamant fortress in the badlands, so perhaps he was in tune to the thinned Veil and thus heard music from the fade where raw lyrium and such powerful magics can be. If it was actually supposed to be the calling from an archdemon Cole heard, I have no idea why he’d hear it, and I admit at first I thought it was that as well, but giving it more thought, I think it was actually something like lyrium he heard. I’m not entirely sure if one can hear music with powerful magic in general, but Adrian heard music of some sort after Wynne got rid of that demon possessing Pharamond with her spirit, and there was no indication of lyrium nearby either. Rhys could also hear music coming from the raw lyrium Wynne used for the ritual, and the lyrium vials Evangeline showed him, which indicates that music being heard by various characters came from either lyrium or some magical power. So perhaps it’s not just lyrium that produces that magical musical sound, and it doesn’t seem likely that Cole heard the archdemon if that were so.
- As to whether or not he killed Lambert, it does sort of hint that he does, as he makes Lambert look into his eyes, much like he did with the girl we see him kill in the cell in the beginning. It’s an interesting tie to the end of the book by referencing something that happens at the beginning of the book. He could always change his mind, like he considered the thought with that woman who survived in the fortress and Pharamond, but he never asked either of them to look at him specifically. Whether or not Lambert dying changes plans against the mages, I don’t know.
- My question about Cole is why he able to make himself invisible to most people and why he can make others disappear etc. if he’s just a person with a spirit/demon in him. Perhaps it’s like the book mentioned, with it being an innate magical ability in Cole manifesting itself in an unusual way, like if someone isn’t that attuned to magic but still possess some ability that shows in odd ways. It’s either that or whatever is possessing him.
- In terms of the red staff Wynne has, my question is more like why would the Warden give Wynne such a dangerous staff that would make her go crazy, lol. Did she just never use it in the presence of the Warden or something? Or was the Warden that kind of person? But it is fun to entertain the idea that it’s the staff from Ostagar.
- Regarding the question about Evangeline, I’m very positive the spirit is in Evangeline now, considering that she actually died and was brought back to life from Wynne, who transferred the spirit to her. Since Wynne was also dead when the spirit brought her back to life all those years ago, it makes sense that Wynne would finally die after having the spirit leave her body since it was the only thing keeping her alive.
- As for the cover of the book, perhaps you’re right. I always thought up until now it was Rhys and Cole, but that helmet and armor doesn’t seem to fit Rhys as a mage, huh? It looks templarish, but not exactly like those in the games, albeit similar. I just thought maybe he was representing his moderate view of the templar/mage conflict by dressing as one, haha. Rhys is described as handsome, with grey starting to show in his beard. Lambert is described as having salt and pepper hair, with sharp, cold grey eyes and a face hewn from solid stone while wearing charcoal black armor like Seeker Cassandra is probably wearing. I’m sort of saddened that Rhys’ looks as a character has less of a description than Lambert, but there you have it. The character on the front doesn’t seem to have salt and pepper hair color, but I really don’t know who it is anymore. I’m definitely sure the person on the back is Cole though.
- As for Lyrium, I don’t think it gives them a type of high, it simply appears to help them with their templar abilities, but it is definitely addictive all the same, and they will go out of their minds if they don’t obtain any for a given period of time, perhaps much like withdrawal.
- As for returning characters in Dragon age 3, they’d have to make Wynne living through Origins officially canon like they did with Leliana if they wish to bring Evangeline and possibly Rhys in DA3. If Wynne is not alive, things would have gone vastly different in Asunder that would greatly affect the lives of Evangeline, Rhys and Cole. Rhys would not have been saved by Wynne from being accused of murder because of Cole, and thus would possibly be made tranquil as suggested, which means everything regarding Evangeline would be vastly different as well. Cole then would not have left the White Spire and would have remained there, possibly in the same state he was in the beginning of the book, murdering or perhaps mercy killing people.