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:I'm curious what versions of Bull and Thom Reiner, you considered to be themselves. I know people have different views, especially on Iron Bull on whether it's true to himself to stay with the Qunn or become Tal'Vosath. Although, since you called him Hissrad, I'm assuming you sacrificed the Chargers? What did you decide for Reiner? [[User:Heidirs|Heidirs]] ([[User talk:Heidirs|talk]]) 16:20, February 19, 2015 (UTC)
 
:I'm curious what versions of Bull and Thom Reiner, you considered to be themselves. I know people have different views, especially on Iron Bull on whether it's true to himself to stay with the Qunn or become Tal'Vosath. Although, since you called him Hissrad, I'm assuming you sacrificed the Chargers? What did you decide for Reiner? [[User:Heidirs|Heidirs]] ([[User talk:Heidirs|talk]]) 16:20, February 19, 2015 (UTC)
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::Correct, I sacrifaced the Chargers, but to save whole numerous crew of the dreadnought. Then I didn't know I'm helping to resolve Hissrad's identity crisis. However I felt good he doesn't have to act anymore. He lived two lives too long, he needed to choose one of them to end his identity crisis. I consider the human as Thom Reiner, one who stole real Blackwall's identity, not as Blackwall the grey warden constable. That's why I called him Thom Reiner. I wanted no more lies, no more secrets, no more dishonesty. I'm straight with all and I expect the same in return.[[User:Andrzej.lewinski.351|Andrzej.lewinski.351]] ([[User talk:Andrzej.lewinski.351|talk]]) 16:31, February 19, 2015 (UTC)
 
::Correct, I sacrifaced the Chargers, but to save whole numerous crew of the dreadnought. Then I didn't know I'm helping to resolve Hissrad's identity crisis. However I felt good he doesn't have to act anymore. He lived two lives too long, he needed to choose one of them to end his identity crisis. I consider the human as Thom Reiner, one who stole real Blackwall's identity, not as Blackwall the grey warden constable. That's why I called him Thom Reiner. I wanted no more lies, no more secrets, no more dishonesty. I'm straight with all and I expect the same in return.[[User:Andrzej.lewinski.351|Andrzej.lewinski.351]] ([[User talk:Andrzej.lewinski.351|talk]]) 16:31, February 19, 2015 (UTC)
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:::I used to have this same kind of debate in my head over Alistair, Leliana, Fenris/Leto and Anders/Justice/Vengeance. Alistair was more grey warden than king but I felt Ferelden needed him, so I hardened him and made him king. Alone, since I never trusted Anora. I told Leliana to leave the chantry behind and embrace her life as a bard. Partially because I felt like she was lying to herself by thinking she belonged with the chantry and partially because I just despise the chantry. As a bard, she seemed more herself. As a lay sister, she seemed like a delusional nutcase. The Leliana's Song DLC just strengthened this decision for me.
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:::Fenris/Leto was a bit more complicated. I never liked him but I liked him even less after the truth about his past came out. I consider Leto to be his name and Danarius' Fenris (little wolf) to be his title. He was never truly a slave. He was a willing servant of Danarius, who fought for the right to bear those markings he supposedly hates so much. Even when he thought otherwise, he still obeyed his commands when he slaughtered the Fog Warriors and left with Danarius and didn't even put up a fight. He would kill his sister if Hawke didn't stop him. His hatred of mages seems to be just an attempt to hide his envy of their power. It seemed like he was jealous of his sister and wanted magic powers himself. Usually if I don't let Danarius take him, he dies after betraying me in the final battle.
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Anders/Justice/Vengeance...this was always a hard one for me. I identified with Anders. He was one of my favorite characters. He was my one of my Warden's closest friends and one of my Hawke's closest friends. He was a mage who simply wanted freedom from the chantry's imprisonment, same as my Warden/Hawke usually were. Justice was interesting, well intentioned and I considered him a friend to both the Warden and Hawke...but he didn't belong in Thedas. He never could. He was a spirit and belonged in the Fade. In the end, both died in a way and the abomination known as Vengeance was born. Still, as close as I was to Anders and as much as I liked Justice, I tried my hardest to save as much of them as I could. I couldn't just sit idly by and watch Vengeance slowly destroy them both. But there was only so much I could do to help them in that battle. [[User:Vampire Damian|Vampire Damian]] ([[User talk:Vampire Damian|talk]]) 01:31, February 20, 2015 (UTC)
   
 
Human. The immutable world of thedas isn't the fade where spirits belong, so he needs to adapt. it is what it is; I just don't agree with the whole "oh but that has human supremacy aspect" of the decision to it. He needs to learn or adapt. Otherwise you'll have ghost of the white spire killing people again. I think it's what's best for cole if he intends to stay in the physical realm.([[User:Sports72Xtrm|Sports72Xtrm]] ([[User talk:Sports72Xtrm|talk]]) 17:53, February 19, 2015 (UTC))
 
Human. The immutable world of thedas isn't the fade where spirits belong, so he needs to adapt. it is what it is; I just don't agree with the whole "oh but that has human supremacy aspect" of the decision to it. He needs to learn or adapt. Otherwise you'll have ghost of the white spire killing people again. I think it's what's best for cole if he intends to stay in the physical realm.([[User:Sports72Xtrm|Sports72Xtrm]] ([[User talk:Sports72Xtrm|talk]]) 17:53, February 19, 2015 (UTC))

Revision as of 01:31, 20 February 2015

H

Forums: Index > Game DiscussionCole: Human or Spirit
Note: This topic has been unedited for 3324 days. It is considered archived - the discussion is over. Do not continue it unless it really needs a response.

I was just curious if people decided to make Cole more human or spirit and why. I chose the spirit path my first play through because I felt like making him more human was changing his true nature - making him into something he wasn't. And I didn't want to do that. I enjoyed the scenes I got of spirit Cole. But I know that in making him human he learns and understands more about human interaction. So, I'm little torn over which path is "better." Heidirs (talk) 15:44, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

Patrick Weeks said in his interview that in that case is no right or wrong decision. I decided to make him more spirit, I wanted to make him himself instead of letting him pretend the real Cole. It wasn't him, so he had no real reason to get his revange. If he was left to die, he would be dead, but the spirit companion isn't the real Cole and never was. I wanted my companions to be themselves, not ones they claim to be. I resolved identity crisis of both Hissrad and Thom Reiner like this.Andrzej.lewinski.351 (talk) 16:12, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

I'm curious what versions of Bull and Thom Reiner, you considered to be themselves. I know people have different views, especially on Iron Bull on whether it's true to himself to stay with the Qunn or become Tal'Vosath. Although, since you called him Hissrad, I'm assuming you sacrificed the Chargers? What did you decide for Reiner? Heidirs (talk) 16:20, February 19, 2015 (UTC)
Correct, I sacrifaced the Chargers, but to save whole numerous crew of the dreadnought. Then I didn't know I'm helping to resolve Hissrad's identity crisis. However I felt good he doesn't have to act anymore. He lived two lives too long, he needed to choose one of them to end his identity crisis. I consider the human as Thom Reiner, one who stole real Blackwall's identity, not as Blackwall the grey warden constable. That's why I called him Thom Reiner. I wanted no more lies, no more secrets, no more dishonesty. I'm straight with all and I expect the same in return.Andrzej.lewinski.351 (talk) 16:31, February 19, 2015 (UTC)
I used to have this same kind of debate in my head over Alistair, Leliana, Fenris/Leto and Anders/Justice/Vengeance. Alistair was more grey warden than king but I felt Ferelden needed him, so I hardened him and made him king. Alone, since I never trusted Anora. I told Leliana to leave the chantry behind and embrace her life as a bard. Partially because I felt like she was lying to herself by thinking she belonged with the chantry and partially because I just despise the chantry. As a bard, she seemed more herself. As a lay sister, she seemed like a delusional nutcase. The Leliana's Song DLC just strengthened this decision for me.
Fenris/Leto was a bit more complicated. I never liked him but I liked him even less after the truth about his past came out. I consider Leto to be his name and Danarius' Fenris (little wolf) to be his title. He was never truly a slave. He was a willing servant of Danarius, who fought for the right to bear those markings he supposedly hates so much. Even when he thought otherwise, he still obeyed his commands when he slaughtered the Fog Warriors and left with Danarius and didn't even put up a fight. He would kill his sister if Hawke didn't stop him. His hatred of mages seems to be just an attempt to hide his envy of their power. It seemed like he was jealous of his sister and wanted magic powers himself. Usually if I don't let Danarius take him, he dies after betraying me in the final battle.

Anders/Justice/Vengeance...this was always a hard one for me. I identified with Anders. He was one of my favorite characters. He was my one of my Warden's closest friends and one of my Hawke's closest friends. He was a mage who simply wanted freedom from the chantry's imprisonment, same as my Warden/Hawke usually were. Justice was interesting, well intentioned and I considered him a friend to both the Warden and Hawke...but he didn't belong in Thedas. He never could. He was a spirit and belonged in the Fade. In the end, both died in a way and the abomination known as Vengeance was born. Still, as close as I was to Anders and as much as I liked Justice, I tried my hardest to save as much of them as I could. I couldn't just sit idly by and watch Vengeance slowly destroy them both. But there was only so much I could do to help them in that battle. Vampire Damian (talk) 01:31, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Human. The immutable world of thedas isn't the fade where spirits belong, so he needs to adapt. it is what it is; I just don't agree with the whole "oh but that has human supremacy aspect" of the decision to it. He needs to learn or adapt. Otherwise you'll have ghost of the white spire killing people again. I think it's what's best for cole if he intends to stay in the physical realm.(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 17:53, February 19, 2015 (UTC))

I made him more human on my first playthrough, though that was more about my character than him, since I played as a hard-ass, so an act of revenge rather than forgiveness felt appropriate. Be this decision on me? I'm torn, really, but would possibly choose the same, knowing the outcome. The thing here is: if you spend your time somewhere it affects you for long enough to change your behavior, what is now your true self? I think this matter extends to the decision over Bull very much as well. I know what I would want in such a situation, but then again, I'm not a man of faith. But there you have it, those are the types of decicions I still love BioWare for. --Rod Weiler (talk) 22:26, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

With Bull, I saved the Chargers. But that was because I felt like his "true self" was with his men. He'd turned himself in to the re-educators because he'd lost his sense of purpose, and then, to hear the stories he and his men tell, he found his purpose away from the Qun with the people he works with. Other people disagree with me, but that's how I interpreted him. With Cole, though, it's harder. I believe he wants to help people, and he can't sense hurts as well when he's human. Still, something about him forgetting the real Cole as a spirit makes me wonder if he's forgetting part of his purpose for coming in the first place - almost as if he went backwards. Heidirs (talk) 00:46, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

I preferred Cole being human. Spirit is cool too, but others have said he needs to adapt and not seek vengeance. nwolC (talk)

The spirit option doesn't have him seek vengeance. It's more forgiving than the human option. Silver Warden (talk) 00:12, February 20, 2015 (UTC)
Exactly, it is the human one that is more about seeking vengeance. Caspoi (talk) 00:18, February 20, 2015 (UTC)
Duh! Clearly I need a break from the internet.nwolC (talk)