I have heard people say they are going to go though and make all the evil choices before, but is that even really possible? If you wanted to go dark what choices would you make?
Depends on which game you mean. In Origins, the generally accepted evil actions are;
- Kill the Dalish elves and condemning the werewolves
- Purge the Circle despite clearing it of demons
- Kill Connor, or kill Isolde to enter the Fade and allow the Demon to keep possessing Connor (Mage Warden only)
- Defile the Sacred Ashes (for extra eviluz, do so in front of Leliana and Wynne)
- Leave Sten in the cage in Lothering
- Kill Loghain and exile Alistair (Male Human Noble only)
There's probably more, but I can't remember. --Madasamadthing (talk) 16:53, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- Evil deeds in the game are so evil that I can't od them, because I'm too good. Alistair hostile to the Warden says "With you who needs darkspawns".
Leaving Redcliffe on mercy of undead despite an option of helping is the most evil thing. . Killing most of people with murder knife is evil, being mean like the merchant in Lothering isn't a reason to kill him. Supporting Branka the Paragon of Bitches and preserving the anvil is also evil, it only accels extinction of the dwarves.
In DAA killing Steafan in this cage is brutal and that's a completelly unnecessary violance, supporting evil Baroness, leaving Amarantine to burn despite fully upgrading the Vigil's keep to minimize damages those things are undoubtfully evil to me. I wonder if letting live mass murderers like Architect or Velanna is evil, same for Morrigan in Witch Hunt.
In DA2 you have many options to kill despite that's not necessary. Supporting dwarven brother, who left own sibling to die is evil. In mage-templar mess my moral compass is broken because both sides are evil in the end, but killing those who surrender isn't good after all. Allowing to execute Bethany is the last thing I would do in this game, killing such nice and sweet girl is FINAL step to HELL or how else people call such places in their religions. Slaying Merrill's clan is another evil deed, they don't deserve this especially if Dalish Warden, who was a hero in true meaning of this word. Calming them down is FAR BETTER and it's more civilised. To saving few qunari you have to commit genocide of many people of Kirkwall, tha city was corrupt and I even think letting Qunari burn it to the ground wouldn't be evil.78.8.15.209 (talk) 17:47, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- I don't know, Madas, I can justify just about anything. Granted, some of the stuff you listed is rather damning, but one sin isn't a life of damnation. To the OP, being evil is a dedication and not necessarily with justification, you gotta be ready to look at the choices and go, "what is wrong with you???" Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 17:53, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- The game actually rewards those who take the morally objectionable approach. So in order for those approaches to work out, they can't exactly be that damning. Which fits in with the Grey Wardens. But then you have the ethics behind each action. Handing over the Anvil of the Void to Branka and Bhelan? You have a King who is willing to send political enemies to the Anvil. Harrowmont instead? It'll be the casteless. Given that you will often called out by companions for those actions and plenty more, they can be considered evil. From the games perspective, its exitus acta probat, the outcome justifies the means. --Madasamadthing (talk) 19:06, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
"Leave Sten in the cage in Lothering"
I beg to differ. I wouldn't call it exactly good, but it is just. He deserves punishment for what he did.
In any case, DA is not exactly the game and the genre to be truly evil. It's your typical heroic fantasy, where the hero saves the day and heroes can't be evil by default. And saving everyone for monetary gain instead of pure selflessness is as "evil" as you can get in most of Bioware games. I'm not blaming them though, such is the genre. There are other games like Overlord or Dungeon Keeper where you can be evil. That's the idea of these games. -Algol- (talk) 18:18, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- Considering that Morrigan, the "token evil teammate", actually calls you out on leaving Sten in the cage, thats pretty despicable, especially when the Darkspawn are almost on Lothering's doorstep. That, it seems, is where even evil has standards. --Madasamadthing (talk) 19:07, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- I disagree, "leaving his fate to the maker" is rather despicable, given that she knows damn well the maker has nothing to do with the world anymore, she's choosing to not choose in hopes the problem will go away, I find the revered mother to be morally repugnant, much like most god geeks. As opposed to the unscrupulous merchant, if you side with him, you can safely feel good in the fact that the high prices will force the refuges to keep moving north, it's a win/win, and a decision has been made; I think the worst choice there is to make them figure it out themselves. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 19:43, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- Well yeah, I do agree on the mother and leaving fate to the maker... But truth be told, I wasn't speaking about the mother. People like her get what they deserve when they start realizing that reality differs from their fairy tales. I was mostly speaking about Sten and what he deserves. He deserves way worse than to be eaten by darkspawn. Even worse than being turned into a ghoul. -Algol- (talk) 20:58, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- I'm not disagreeing on that part. However, in retrospect, if joining your party and helping the Warden end the blight helps him to attain his atonement, then leaving him in the cage is also evil in a sense. We've all done things we regret, we've all lashed out over something silly, we've all paid the price one way or another. Sten's situation is why we a legal clause called second degree murder; he is a killer by trade, but not a murder; a common man in his situation may have attempted the same, maiming the family and possibly killing one or two, before coming back to reality, but Sten is a walking weapon, ergo second degree, heat of the moment with what's at hand, very different from Howe, who actively plans and carries out his vileness, Howe IS a murderer, of the first degree, motive means and opportunity. Tabris is a rather fuzzy scenerio, blurring the degrees of murder into a big glop, starting with escaping, which falls under murder in self defense, or third degree murder, followed quickly by a long string of second degree murders, culminating, usually, in the first degree murder of the Arl's son. All in all, releasing Sten is reasonably gratifying; and you get a meat shield out of the deal. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 21:31, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- You're just an anti-Chantry fanatic, "Leaving Sten in the fate of the Maker" is a metaphor and you try to paint every chantry member as evil, even if they aren't. Killers must be punished. Fact that you have no respect for other religions gives you no right to insult, you are also a religious zealot, but your religion is atheism. Additionally delating text of other wikia contributor shows you have no respect for those who have different opinion. King Cousland already warned you.78.8.130.79 (talk) 07:30, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- Atheism as a religion... Clap clap clap. 82.131.238.64 (talk) 08:06, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- Short-sighted narrow-minded and with poor vocabulary. Religion is what people believe and have no evidence. Atheists believe there is no deity but have no proof, so that's also a religion. Atheists have nothing to prove they're correct, same with people, who follow any religion. Religious zealots, who were Atheists were soldier of comunnist parties ruling Eastern Europe. So don't even try tell atheism is no religion.78.8.130.79 (talk) 10:07, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- Let's try to keep this on topic. We're discussing the actions of a fictional character in a fictional world who subscribes to a fictional religion. Talking about atheism and whether it is a religion or not has no bearing on the topic. Nor do personal attacks on the poster.
- Short-sighted narrow-minded and with poor vocabulary. Religion is what people believe and have no evidence. Atheists believe there is no deity but have no proof, so that's also a religion. Atheists have nothing to prove they're correct, same with people, who follow any religion. Religious zealots, who were Atheists were soldier of comunnist parties ruling Eastern Europe. So don't even try tell atheism is no religion.78.8.130.79 (talk) 10:07, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- Atheism as a religion... Clap clap clap. 82.131.238.64 (talk) 08:06, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- You're just an anti-Chantry fanatic, "Leaving Sten in the fate of the Maker" is a metaphor and you try to paint every chantry member as evil, even if they aren't. Killers must be punished. Fact that you have no respect for other religions gives you no right to insult, you are also a religious zealot, but your religion is atheism. Additionally delating text of other wikia contributor shows you have no respect for those who have different opinion. King Cousland already warned you.78.8.130.79 (talk) 07:30, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- I'm not disagreeing on that part. However, in retrospect, if joining your party and helping the Warden end the blight helps him to attain his atonement, then leaving him in the cage is also evil in a sense. We've all done things we regret, we've all lashed out over something silly, we've all paid the price one way or another. Sten's situation is why we a legal clause called second degree murder; he is a killer by trade, but not a murder; a common man in his situation may have attempted the same, maiming the family and possibly killing one or two, before coming back to reality, but Sten is a walking weapon, ergo second degree, heat of the moment with what's at hand, very different from Howe, who actively plans and carries out his vileness, Howe IS a murderer, of the first degree, motive means and opportunity. Tabris is a rather fuzzy scenerio, blurring the degrees of murder into a big glop, starting with escaping, which falls under murder in self defense, or third degree murder, followed quickly by a long string of second degree murders, culminating, usually, in the first degree murder of the Arl's son. All in all, releasing Sten is reasonably gratifying; and you get a meat shield out of the deal. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 21:31, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
Anyway, leaving Sten in the cage may seem cruel, but I don't think it is an evil act. What else is the Revered Mother supposed to do? Lothering has no law. The Bann left with all his men and retainers, leaving no one in charge. The Chantry stepped in to do what it can, but it has no legal authority to do anything. We never hear about courts or judges in DA:O. Most legal matters seem to be solved by the noble in charge rendering an absolute decicion (see the "courtroom" scene in Awakenings). With no Bann there can be no decision. Also, Lothering has no prison (it's a country town, it's no Redcliffe or Denerim). If she sent Sten to one of those places she would need men to escort him, which she doesn't have. She can't execute him, either. She has no authority to do that, either. Plus, who would do it? The Templars could (the bandit on the gates of town says as much), but that's not their job and they have their hands full just keepin the community together. She can't release him and recruiting him to join the militia to protect the town would cause even more problems. She really has no choice but to leave him there.
- On the first issue; seeing a game version of religion, puts into stark contrast, the problems WITH religion. On the second issue; if killers MUST be punished, then the Warden MUST be punished, as well as every soldier who fought in a war, and every executioner who's every committed a capital punishment, along with every judge and jury who's ever directed a capital punishment through command or negligence; ramifications are a bitch, this makes the Revered Mother a killer through negligence, and killers MUST be punished. On the third issue; my deleting text, I can only surmise as to be the fault of the site, as it can not seem to comprehend that two geeks might be posting at the same time. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 10:15, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- On the 2nd issue Loghain sent his soldiers against Warden, he followed the rule killer must be killed because he framed the Warden in regicide. Again you only show you're anti-chantry fanatic because you only seek excuses. Your provacations are pathetic.78.8.130.79 (talk) 10:38, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- On the first issue; seeing a game version of religion, puts into stark contrast, the problems WITH religion. On the second issue; if killers MUST be punished, then the Warden MUST be punished, as well as every soldier who fought in a war, and every executioner who's every committed a capital punishment, along with every judge and jury who's ever directed a capital punishment through command or negligence; ramifications are a bitch, this makes the Revered Mother a killer through negligence, and killers MUST be punished. On the third issue; my deleting text, I can only surmise as to be the fault of the site, as it can not seem to comprehend that two geeks might be posting at the same time. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 10:15, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
There's no right or wrong, this isnt fable, there are different opinions and perspectives, none of the choices are evil, depending on your point of view any of the choices can be seen as the reasonable or right thing to do depending on your opinion Blighter (talk) 21:19, April 1, 2013 (UTC)
- What about actions which have no reason at all to do them? Like killing that wounded soldier when you enter the Korcari Wilds?
- Anyway, one of my favourite walkthroughs is an evil person who would do anything to gain from a situation. I like being evil in a video game, since I am not iRL.
10:18, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- I haven't known you from that side, Victoria, you began to scare me. I have too much of conscience to be evil. It's not easy for me like for you.78.8.130.79 (talk) 10:40, April 2, 2013 (UTC) Just call me Dalish fan
- Because videogames are serious business, no kidding. Maybe you wouldn't be so scared if you stopped mixing them with real life. Also register, for crying out lout, this is getting really old and a bit annoying. If you can't remember the password, write it down somewhere. -Algol- (talk) 11:55, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- It's nothing wrong if someone does not want to register. 12:22, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- It's nothing wrong if someone does not want to register.
- Because videogames are serious business, no kidding. Maybe you wouldn't be so scared if you stopped mixing them with real life. Also register, for crying out lout, this is getting really old and a bit annoying. If you can't remember the password, write it down somewhere. -Algol- (talk) 11:55, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- I haven't known you from that side, Victoria, you began to scare me. I have too much of conscience to be evil. It's not easy for me like for you.78.8.130.79 (talk) 10:40, April 2, 2013 (UTC) Just call me Dalish fan
- "I have too much of conscience to be evil"...ahahaha, no. What you have is just smug condescencion with a whiff of bullshit. Dorquemada (talk) 15:49, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
Can evil be a charcter, who achieves his goals by manipulations or bribing or provoking enemies to kill each other? On of my Wardens told Kolgrim he'll help him, but then he was decieved, I used him, but I don't feel that's evil, but clever. In DA2 I sided with Janeka and then returned to Larius and the effect was she was only warden, who died.78.8.130.79 (talk) 10:44, April 2, 2013 (UTC) Just call me Dalish fan
- "History is written by the winners." Napolian Bonparte; and the winners are never evil. Shadizar666 (Ruck Rules) 11:00, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- On war moral compasses don't work, there only matter is survival.78.8.130.79 (talk) 11:07, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- Fighting in order to survive is meaningless if you lose your morals along the way. It's one thing to kill enemy soldier, but it's another to, for example, bomb a hospital with innocent people inside. Or are you saying that it doesn't matter and absolutely everything is allowed just because it's war? Yammamoto69 (talk) 12:44, April 2, 2013 (UTC)
- On war moral compasses don't work, there only matter is survival.78.8.130.79 (talk) 11:07, April 2, 2013 (UTC)