Forum:BW's Ray Muzyka Wonders if DA:O Fans Expected a Similar Experience From DAII

Forums: Index > Game DiscussionBW's Ray Muzyka Wonders if DA:O Fans Expected a Similar Experience From DAII

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Comments from BW's Ray Muzyka reported today in a newsbit from RPGWatch. The original article is short and came from Industrygamers. I'm still scratching my head over this one. --WarPaint (talk) 22:46, August 10, 2011 (UTC)

This doesn't surprise me at all. Since the release of DA2 the folks at Bioware have been acting clueless on why fans are hating on their "Masterpiece". I'm sure its all an act to stand by their product and to appease their EA overlords. Bioware sold out unfortunately.--Vincent Cousland (talk) 22:51, August 10, 2011 (UTC)

What is discouraging about his statements? Tommyspa (talk) 23:03, August 10, 2011 (UTC)

"We also recognize that feedback from core fans is incredibly important, so we take that to heart. We’re listening to it. We’re commercially successful, so we actually drew a lot of new fans in, exceeded our expectations, and what we want to do in the future is make sure we integrate that feedback from our core fans, so they come along with us for the journey, as we continue to build up the Dragon Age franchise and make the next ones even bigger and better so that all of our fans are delighted and surprised."

This is the type of thinking that brings us the wonderful world of reality TV. Ooooh, look! The lemmings and sheep love it! It must be good. They are clearly after the all-mighty buck, and it doesn't matter to them if they have to sell out to get there. Gone are the days when people make a product that they are damn proud of, and are just happy with being successful. They now want to have the biggest financial success possible, fans be damned. RPG's are a niche product. Sci-fi is a niche product, etc. Nobody wants to cater to the individual niche any more. It's like the pizza places that aren't happy being the best pizza place in town; they need to sell subs, calzones, chicken wings, ice cream, etc., because "everyone else is doing it." It's a shame. If you want the action game audience, make an action game AND an RPG. Don't try to make them into one genre. What's next? Is your Madden game to going to have add-ons that include magic cleats and players with spells, just to get some of the RPG'ers to play football? Enough already! LVTDUDE (talk) 23:09, August 10, 2011 (UTC)

You think they might have been disappointed because MAYBE they were expecting DA2 to be like it's predecessor? I personally loved a lot of the changes, but it should be no surprise that you alienated some people by making those changes. TKismyname (talk) 23:11, August 10, 2011 (UTC)

Oh well. I get it, they want to make a certain type of game and not the game that was popular again. I can respect that on many levels actually to be honest as it's what they want to do, and doing what you want is great. I doubt they'll have time to change much anyway really. But the people who left, and those of us hanging around to see what happens next, a sizable portion of the total sales of DA2...well, we probably won't be all that interested I think. Maybe enough to buy a $20-$30 game on discount that BW/EA gets almost nothing for, but they're not going to make any bank next time this way. And no profit means no more games. It's a huge risk. Let's hope they know what they are doing. The Grey Unknown (talk) 00:53, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I'll LMAO if I ever see vMadden DLC that gives equipment with a 5%increase in running speed. But its like my dad use to tell me: leaving old friends behind for new acquaintances doesn't work out well in the long run. Mostly. Improvement in combat and such I can understand and appreciate, but some of the changes made to the game JUST to attract a younger crowd...grinds my gears a bit. High Kicks (talk) 01:30, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

When you start reading the interview and you slowly understand that Bioware are trying to forget about the old fans, and try to become hip and cool with the younger crowd and new fans just makes you cringe and pisses you off, doesn't it? To be honest Bioware, I believe there's no stalemate in this franchise anymore, you can't have a ballance in Dragon Age. You have to pick sides, like mages and templars (haha) Either choose to stay true to your old fans, your REAL fans, and bring back what made Dragon Age cool, or you can forget about that and like many people before me said, try to make an action-RPG-shooter-racing-sports game, and please the new people that played the game for the fancy graphics. There's no real balance, You have to choose sides Bioware. To me it seems they've already chosen and they've chosen the latter. There's no question about it, of course I'm gonna keep buying their products, it would be stupid to question why, but I've lost faith in Bioware. I used to be a huge Dragon Age fan but now I believe that time might be over soon, I think I'm gonna keep my hopes up so they don't screw up Mass Effect... And of course I have nothing against the new fans, it's just Bioware and EA that are ticking me off... But that's just me and my opinion only. Danerogil (talk) 03:02, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I was surprised BioWare was even pretending to care about their old fans (of which I am not technically though I played Origins and KOTOR). As long as they keep us on the up and up with development this time 'round, it won't be such a huge surprise. Xelestial (talk) 04:05, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I have a feeling DA3 is going to come out as another DA2 all flash but no substance.DarkDabber (talk) 04:32, August 11, 2011 (UTC)DarkDabber

I blame EA more than BioWare. While admittedly some of the changes they made alienated many of the fans from DA:O, I can't say they're wrong for doing it, or that they're sell-outs. Just cause something didn't get the anticipated response doesn't mean the developers aren't sincere in wanting to know what were the changes they made that upset the fans. Personally I get why they can't keep the same PC throughout all the DA games. I'm willing to see how DA3 turns out and hope BW somehow blends the best of both games. The streamlined gameplay from DA2 and the flavour from DAO. I think they put themselves in a corner a bit with the whole release the sequel 2 years later thing, but I think a lot of what caused major issues with both games was EA trying to milk the most out of the franchise. Bash BW all you guys want but I find it hard for any of the BW team to stand up to the people writing their paychecks. ReaperZ (talk) 05:52, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure where this fascination and accusations of selling out of bioware come from. Dragon age was the first game I played from them, since then however I have played a few others and in perspective DA2 is not nearly as bad as I had originally thought. I am beginning to think under the assumption that origins was just a fluke and such quality should not be expected to be reproduced.174.45.9.40 (talk) 06:58, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

Hmm, which ones do you mean? I've played ME and ME 2 so far from them and I found both of them to be better games than DA 2. Both are more pleasing in the action department AND are full of choices. Also, they pedantically worked to make the import feature of ME 2 actually feel like you're continuing the story of your character from the first game. Comparing these two games, it seems obvious DA 2 was rushed and its import feature was done clumsily. Lemonaidz (talk) 07:22, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I'm fairly certain that Origins was the first Bioware game I ever played. I am a new Bioware fan and they're doing a good job of alienating me already. Especially since I played ME2 and thought it was just.. bad. Now that I think of it, Mass Effect as a concept is just bad, I'll probably get a lot of heat for this, but a game like that seems to be what we've been bitching about. The ultimate compromise, gather all the Halo fanboys with the flashy gun shooting action, and sucker in fans of RPG with some really shallow stats, and that wouldn't be so bad. Borderland's is a solid game, and Fallout 3 looked cool, but Mass Effect.. No, nooooo. I think I'll play Final Fantasy VIII or X-2 instead.HomelyDrugAddict (talk) 07:58, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

AHG! Fanboy rage mode active! Ha ha, JK. I totally respect your opinion, but where dose it say in the RPG hand book that a good RPG can't have flashy gun shooting. I think the first Mass Effect is an example of a what an RPG shooter should be, were Mass 2 is more an example of what a shooter RPG should be. Andy the Black (talk) 08:28, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

That was probably an unfair statement on my end. I just.. don't like shooters. Halo fucked up the gaming industry for me, because it was soooo popular shooters became the main thing, so I got pretty alienated. So when I see them introducing shooter elements into my RPG's, it irks me a little bit. Like when Dirge of Cerberus came out, I am and always will be a Final Fantasy VII fanboy, and it was like they shit all over it's memory with a shooting game.HomelyDrugAddict (talk) 08:49, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

Dude, I totally feel you. While I don't hate shooters I do think games like CoD are bringing gaming down a level. CoD is the reality tv of the gaming industry. Andy the Black (talk) 08:59, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I have the same mental disorders you do, maybe we're just forced by our nature to be displeased, counter-culture assholes.HomelyDrugAddict (talk) 09:07, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I'll disagree with your anti-shooter ideology, but I have one question to ask you: how's the plot for the ME series? Better than DA series? Admittedly, I don't even know if the DA series HAS an overarching plot, but still. Quirkynature (talk) 11:06, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I loved Mass Effect, and its sequel was nothing like this mess with DA2. If you want a truly well-made franchise, jump ship to Ubisoft - yes their PC DRM policy is ludicrous, but they've sorted their act (just) and Assassin's Creed puts Dragon Age to shame. Phylarion (talk) 11:19, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

On a game to game basis I'd asy DA:O and Mass 1 are on about the same level. Mass Effect's story is basically mad man trying to bring back an ancient evil to wipe out the galaxy, and you know Origins story. Mass 2s story is a continuation of Shepard's quest to stop the ancient evil. As a series, in my view, Mass Effect wins. Dragon Age dosn't have a overall story, well not one thats currently aberrant anyway. Andy the Black (talk) 14:38, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I think that's the great thing about the Dragon Age world. Sure, there's no overall story. The story is suppose to be about the world and how it works. So, that gives us I world we can explore and discover its secrets. With DA2 I was expecting them to at least ANSWER a few questions as to WTF is going on, but nooo. We started with the Blight and Darkspawn and Archdemons and Flemeth. Then talking Darkspawn and why the 5th Blight even happened. The mage/templar tension was always there. Then Hawke shows up, gets an origins story of sorts. Thedas is filled with questions, but no answers.High Kicks (talk) 15:00, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

Exactly! I also really dislike how from Origins to DA2 you just jump ship from the main story being about the Grey Wardens and the Darkspawn, to a pseudo-political civil war between religious extremism and scientific(magical) liberties.

And while I never played ME1, but I did play ME2, and from what I hear ME1 had more standard RPG elements than ME2. I had no great connection to Shepard in ME2, and all of the choices felt like they really had a minimal effect, or were simply put in for 'cinematic value'. ME2 really did feel more like an 'interactive movie', which really got me bored quick.

Origins on the other hand really caught me in it's grasp right away, and I was sad when it came to an end. Then Awakening came along, and for the most part it was a good expansion, but left many unanswered questions about my Warden's future. But at least Anders was likable back then... Leliana's Song really gave a tease of what DA2 could really be like, and for the most part I really liked it, but I still really didn't like the paraphrasing. Then Darkspawn Chronicles... It was alright, but little did I know it was the paving stone for DA2's combat and progression... And then Witch Hunt... It was alright, and it was nice meeting Morrigan again... But it really felt, I don't know... Incomplete, I think is the word. Fell a little too short. Kind of a cheap way of showing off some of the LIGHTLY touched subjects that would show up in DA2.

All in all, I just hope BioWare can redeem themselves with DA3, or whatever it'll be called. But I have a weird feeling I know what's going to happen and who the hero's origin will be... And I don't think it'll work quite right if they do, so I can only hope I won't be right... Like I was for DA2. DeltaEcho (talk) 16:01, August 11, 2011 (UTC)

I expected a similar experience until I read about what they were doing with DA2.

Instead of fighting between combat systems, why can't we just have both. I mean really just add it in the options menu for DA3. (goes to options menu, chooses DA2 combat system

I have a strange feeling that Bioware will listen to the fans this time because more people who like it= more sales. So even if all they care about now is money (as some people think), they have to listen to fans to make money. Yash7 (talk) 16:58, August 11, 2011 (UTC)