Could anybody give me an explanation for the Black City other than the standard Chantry explanation? Without an alternate explanation it seems to confirm the Maker as the actual creator in Dragon Age and I like to stay unsure when it comes to religion in videogames, unless the Maker definitely is the real creator, in which case I would like that confirmed.Arkangel37 (talk) 02:45, June 10, 2013 (UTC)
We know that the ancient magisters reached the city and Coryphues confirmed it, however he states that the city was black already. I think the Primeval dwarves were mages even earlier than elves. They could corrupt it because of a terrible experiment and it also caused them to extinct and turn into the rock wraiths. They experimented with red lyrium or maybe the red lyrium is a corrupted lyrium as result of that experiment.
Elves don't believe their gods lived in Fade, but has something similar to the golden city with different functions.78.8.139.109 (talk) 06:56, June 10, 2013 (UTC)
- I think it has everything to do with the Old Gods. What if the prisons beneath the earth that hold the old gods are not prisons at all, but their sanctuaries? What if the Golden/Black city was actually a prison for the Old Gods, one they became trapped in while exploring the fade? This would leave their bodies in a permanent slumber in their underground sanctuaries that their ancient enemies could not find or reach (perhaps the Elven pantheon?).
- When the Old Gods sensed the arrival of humans to the continent, they reached out to them and tantalized them with thoughts of power. Egged them into invading the city. But the magisters arrived at the Golden city only to receive a curse from the Old Gods imprisoned there. Unable to leave themselves, the Old Gods cursed the magisters to seek them out underground and wake them from their slumber. They could not risk simply telling the magisters to find them, as they did not trust them (what if the magisters would doubt the power of the Gods upon finding just a sleeping dragon?).
- The archdemons may be the true form of the old gods, or perhaps the taint curses the old gods as well, and this was not intended.
- Regardless, I don't think the existence of the Black city or of Corypheus' story validates the chant of light. All we know for certain is that there was a city in the fade, some magisters visited the city, the city changed color just before this visit, and the magisters brought the taint back with them. I don't see why that implies that the Maker must be involved.
- In addition to the similarities between the story of Old Gods being imprisoned, and the Elven stories of their own gods (good and evil both) being imprisoned (part of the reason I thought maybe the Elven pantheon was the ancient enemy of the Old gods), I was always intrigued by the topic of immortality in Dragon Age. Originally the Elves were immortal, but this began to cease with the arrival of humans. In "modern" times, the darkspawn are immortal. I've wondered if in both cases the Golden/Black city was the source of this immortality. 68.119.148.166 (talk) 10:42, June 10, 2013 (UTC)
- Similarities between religions doesn't mean they are conected. Hinduists and Christians both had their own divine thrinities, but they never met before era of discoveries of new lands.78.8.139.109 (talk) 14:47, June 10, 2013 (UTC)
Well, the only person we've ever met who's actually been there says it was Black when he arrived. I'm sure Corypheus would have mentioned if it were Golden.
"Okay, so it was totally golden and beautiful but then this big booming voice from nowhere told us we totally weren't welcome in his crib and then things turned black and suddenly my clothing had fused with my flesh and I looked like a Giger painting. Worst. Road Trip. Ever."
Personally, I believe that the Old Gods' spirits were imprisoned there, or stuck, keeping their physical bodies sleeping beneath the earth, just like any other sentient being who goes to the Fade when they dream. They were stuck, they reached out to mortal worshipers to get them unstuck, but something went terribly wrong.. (Dun dun dunnn) The Spirits of the Old Gods, or at least a part of them, somehow became attached to the Magisters, and reacted badly with their vessels, corrupting and tainting them, or, perhaps, being corrupted and tainted BY their vessels. The Magisters were awful people, after all. Wouldn't want my soul in one of them, no siree. Anywho, the newly created Darkspawn spread their taint, grew their numbers, and then tried to fulfill their original purpose; that is, to free the Old Gods from imprisonment. When the essence of the Old Gods was transferred back, it was all wrong, and twisted Dumat into an Archdemon. He'd been corrupted by the greed, lust for power, and cruelty of his mortal servants, just as they had been twisted by his essence into physical representations of their own nature. This also provides a convenient explanation for why Corypheus exudes a Calling of his own, and why the Archdemons can body-surf between Darkspawn hosts. They're all infused with at least a part of the Old Gods' essence, Corypheus more than most since he got a shotgun blast of it to his face. 98.195.61.36 (talk) 02:17, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
Theory abou the city as prison for the old gods is failed. The darkspawns dig for centuries to him another old god. If the city was a prison of them, the darkspawns already knew the location of another dead god, because that would be a next cell. Also if the city is the prison, then why didn't darkspawns release all those gods? No, the prisons of the old gods are separate and far from each other, not in one place.78.8.107.176 (talk) 06:35, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
- It's not - it is a prison for their soul/spirit. It doesn't need to function like a normal one. The gods are freed when the Darkspawn disturb their physical forms, which are scattered throught Thedas. Where do you see the problem? 79.184.181.50 (talk) 17:18, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
- Plus, you have to think that if you had a group of sleeping gods, would you keep them so they could all be awoken at the same time? Or spread them out so they could be brought back one at a time and killed before the others come along. --Halisme (talk) 18:20, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
But does anybody know how the Black City got there in the first place? Or why it can be seen from everywhere in the Fade? 65.184.249.129 (talk) 11:34, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
- My guess is that the city was created by the Elven "gods", who may have been immensely powerful spirits, and was always intended as a prison for the spirits of the old gods. Perhaps the elven gods destroyed themselves to make it, or are locked in there along with the remaining Old God spirits. It could in fact be the prison the elven legends spoke of (the good Gods were imprisoned above, meaning they went to the fade, and the evil gods were imprisoned below, meaning they entered the fade while underground, and were unable to return to their bodies).
- Now, why can it be seen from everywhere, that is how you are unable to reach it. To make the city impossible to reach once the Old God spirits were trapped there, something had to be done so that no amount of travel could get you there. I think about the Earth and its core. If the Earth were transparent, you could see the core from any point on the surface. But no amount of walking would ever get you there. So the City occupies some special magical position in the fade, such that no matter where you go, you never get any closer to it. 131.215.35.183 (talk) 23:16, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
But if you didn't want anybody to reach it, couldn't you place it so that it is still always in the same place relative to you in the Fade, but far further away so nobody would even ever see it or know about it? 65.184.249.129 (talk) 11:27, June 16, 2013 (UTC)
- Maybe the Black City is unreachable because people believe that it's unreachable. The Fade is supposed to be this place where the laws of physics and everything else are dictated by what it's denizens and visitors believe and will into existence. The environment, their own forms are what they believe or want to be. In the Broken Circle quest where you get trapped in the Fade, the world is built by what the demons want, your companions are trapped in their own fantasies/nightmares unless you can reason with them and get them to remember the course of events that brought them there, your Warden learns to change their physical form. You have to confront Feynriel with facts he believes to be true instead of directly challenging his desires to break the demons' hold on him. Shah Wyrd was supposedly a being that formed in the the Fade from random, distracted thoughts from one or more people.
- You have the entirety of the world believing that they can't get to the Black City in the middle of the Fade. Who's to say that's not the reason why? It could explain why it's always the same distance away no matter where in the Fade you happen to be. Whether you believe it or not, a LOT of people believe you can't get to the Black City, and that you couldn't get to the Golden City before that. Maybe that's what the magisters learned from Dumat, or whatever entity it was they were communing with, that they only had to truly believe they could get there, and will a path into existence. --Jeslaut 21:26, June 17, 2013 (UTC)