149 Votes in Poll
@Soren-berdichev You know that the Architect in his current state has nothing to do with Corypheus right? The guy doesn't even remember him. We must judge them individually at least for now.
Not remembering one's past doesn't mean you are a wholly different person. How much a person's nature is connected with his memory? Who could say that with certainty?
However, I have little doubt his vainglory is why Corypheus seeks him out first. The Architect perhaps no longer has his memory, but still full of vainglory and arrogance. That means he is likely still the same kind of person.
People should really read the novels lol
Whether he is evil or not isn't the problem. The problem is trying to have a peaceful co-existence with Darkspawn isn't possible due to them possibly passing their blight disease to other life forms.
@Dwarftank Couldn't they just isolate themselves in some corner of the Deep Roads nobody goes too? Seriously the Deep Roads AREN'T Dwarven Territory anymore and they won't be even if the Dwarves start winning it takes many generations to effectively recover any single thaig. Once you take out the Archdemons and the Darkspawn are cured of the Calling they literally have no reason to try to go towards the surface where they literally ALWAYS lose and die. That was part of the Architect's argument.
Also if the Calling can be cured...Why not the Taint itself? We might find out we could in fact render any negative of the Taint ineffective in the future. (Literally what the Dark Ritual and Fiona's fate majorly hint at.)
My main problem is causing the genocide of a Sentient Enslaved Species despite having the chance for Peace. If we're wrong to spare him we could always fix it later by killing him. If we're wrong to kill the Architect and he doesn't come back then we just negated the one single chance to end the Darkspawn Horde/Blights peacefully without the loss of more lives. I'd rather take the chance of sparing him myself and yes I consider it the ethical thing to do. He was right any evils he did so did the Wardens from the other side of the coin...If we're to condemn him we should also be condemning the Order otherwise we're the amoral hypocrites.
"Couldn't they just isolate themselves in some corner of the Deep Roads nobody goes too?..."
They could. But to what end? The only positive thing that "good" Darkspawn can offer to the humanoids of Thedas is by killing "bad" Darkspawn. If all one is doing is fighting. That means that "good" Darkspawn will die. The only way to get more darkspawn is by capturing a female humanoid and turning them into a Broodmother. Which, giving away humanoid females, or as a form of punishment, condemning female humanoids to bolster "good" darkspawn is a bridge to far for me.
"Also if the Calling can be cured...Why not the Taint itself?.."
Darkspawn are believed to be soulless creatures. The taint is what appears to give them "life." The logical reasoning would be that if Darkspawn didn't have the taint, that they would die. I'm all for that. That is most likely why Fiona survived having the Taint removed from her. Because she is still a humanoid with a soul. She also wasn't created by the taint. In comparison to Darkspawn not being humanoids, don't have a soul and were created by the taint. I know we have our disagreements on souls.
"My main problem is causing the genocide of a Sentient Enslaved Species despite having the chance for Peace."
That is based on the assumption that he truly wants peace between darkspawn and the rest of Thedas. Who the heck knows what he really wants? This is also the same dude that helped sacrificed thousands of Elven Slaves through a ritual using 2/3 of all of Tevinter's lyrium to enter the Fade physically. Ancient Tevinter Magisters were not good people. Especially the Magisters Sidereal. He isn't trustworthy. The thinking that a person would be more ethical, good, moral, whatever, after they have been tainted by a supernatural property, is very unlikely to me. He wanted to be elevated to Godhood by entering the fade physically. I trust no being that wants to elevate themselves to Godhood.
I understand where you are coming from. For me though, due to him being tainted, his past deeds before he was tainted, not sure of his true intentions and the just the fact that his people can infect humanoids w/the blight. The darkspawn that do follow him, if they get far enough away from him, they lose control and give into their blood lust. A darkspawn's nature to is be violent and not empathetic to other life forms. It isn't a risk worth taking.
@Dwarftank "Darkspawn are believed to be soulless creatures." Nothing confirmed as factual. Remember I'm the person that doesn't believe any living being has a soul to begin with. So we've already argued that point.
@Dwarftank You're assuming the only way to really create Darkspawn is through a Broodmother and that every current Broodmother would turn into an Evil Darkspawn like the Mother instead of a Good one. While yes it the only form of creation we know about you have to realize that the Good Darkspawn have never existed before. Darkspawn cut off from the Calling have never existed before. What if the Broodmother Method is only a Horde method that the Archdemons/Old Gods force upon their vassals instead of a more natural way like the other races...Perhaps the Darkspawn can in fact have individual reproduction that doesn't require various lifeform sacrifices?
You gave a reason for the Taint being cured as a supposed doomsday for Darkspawn. But you didn't discuss the other option I listed of negating the infective/negative element of the Taint through either causing Immunity for Mortals or simply changing the Curse/Virus that is the Taint itself forcing it to become a less parasitic or contagious disease. So beings that are Tainted wouldn't infect the land or other living beings. An Anti-Taint if you will. In a World of Magic that seemingly always has a counterfoil/opposite that seems a possibility.
"That is based on the assumption that he truly wants peace between darkspawn and the rest of Thedas"
I know it might sound foolish and naive but I'll willingly make that assumption because I believe him when he said he's made "mistakes" and never meant for the hostility he has with the Order. I just do. I guess I'd like to believe that he's telling us his version of the truth because the alternative is to believe that living beings Cursed and Enslaved are inherently evil. I don't want to believe that's the case...I refuse to believe that's the case.
But like I said if I'm wrong there's always a chance to fix that mistake down the line. If others are wrong if I kill him and it turns out he was telling us the truth and there's a way to peacefully coexist then we literally just commited genocide killing the good along with the bad out of fear of the unknown. It's not something I ever wish to do. I see it as a parallel to the Mages and Elves and Tevinters and even Qunari. Some can be evil but certainly not all certainly not because of any predetermined destiny. In other words I truly believe in redemption and goodwill is possible in such a being despite it all.
I get why you would disagree with me. I honestly think this is the most morally ambiguous choice in the series. But it's how I see and feel about the situation.
"Darkspawn are believed to be soulless creatures." Nothing confirmed as factual. Remember I'm the person that doesn't believe any living being has a soul to begin with. So we've already argued that point."
Yes we did. That is why I brought it up. To show that I care enough to pay attention to what you write.
"You're assuming the only way to really create Darkspawn is through a Broodmother and that every current Broodmother would turn into an Evil Darkspawn like the Mother instead of a Good one. While yes it the only form of creation we know about you have to realize that the Good Darkspawn have never existed before. Darkspawn cut off from the Calling have never existed before. What if the Broodmother Method is only a Horde method that the Archdemons/Old Gods force upon their vassals instead of a more natural way like the other races...Perhaps the Darkspawn can in fact have individual reproduction that doesn't require various lifeform sacrifices?"
Darkspawn are asexual and lack the ability to reproduce. Broodmothers are the only way. What female humanoids would you be willing to sacrifice to see if you can make a "good" broodmother? Good luck finding any willing volunteers as well.
"You gave a reason for the Taint being cured as a supposed doomsday for Darkspawn. But you didn't discuss the other option I listed of negating the infective/negative element of the Taint through either causing Immunity for Mortals or simply changing the Curse/Virus that is the Taint itself forcing it to become a less parasitic or contagious disease. So beings that are Tainted wouldn't infect the land or other living beings. An Anti-Taint if you will. In a World of Magic that seemingly always has a counterfoil/opposite that seems a possibility."
Darkspawn don't need food to sustain their life. The taint is what gives them life. Diminishing the Taint in any way, and you will lessen or kill them. Which is fine with me. Grey Wardens, in a way, have a Anti(ish)-Taint. It still kills them, just slowly. Unless you would be willing to become tainted and then apply the Anti-taint to yourself to see if it works. Then this science experiment is a non-starter. The taint also 99.999999999999999999% of the time renders the humanoid ineffective with regards to reproducing. So now, not only do you have to develop this Anti-Taint miracle that would save the persons life, this Anti-Taint miracle would also have to cure infertility. If the Taint/Blight truly came from The Maker. Than logically speaking, as powerful as "he" probably is, humanoids *even with the gift of magic,* may not be capable enough to even render the taint obsolete.
"I know it might sound foolish and naive but I'll willingly make that assumption because I believe him when he said he's made "mistakes" and never meant for the hostility he has with the Order. I just do. I guess I'd like to believe that he's telling us his version of the truth because the alternative is to believe that living beings Cursed and Enslaved are inherently evil. I don't want to believe that's the case...I refuse to believe that's the case."
Make sure you can separate the difference of what the truth is or may be and what you want the truth to be.
"But like I said if I'm wrong there's always a chance to fix that mistake down the line."
That is if your character is still alive or even capable enough to defeat a being that is immortal and has immense power.
"If others are wrong if I kill him and it turns out he was telling us the truth and there's a way to peacefully coexist then we literally just commited genocide killing the good along with the bad out of fear of the unknown. It's not something I ever wish to do. I see it as a parallel to the Mages and Elves and Tevinters and even Qunari. Some can be evil but certainly not all certainly not because of any predetermined destiny. In other words I truly believe in redemption and goodwill is possible in such a being despite it all."
You have a good heart. It is just misguided in this regard.
@Dwarftank Broodmothers are the only way we THINK is how they can reproduce...While they're in a system of magical enslavement by the Old Gods/Archdemons/Blight that actively seeks to corrupt and destroy life as a whole. There'd be no need for further sacrifices I'm talking about the ones already in existence.
Fiona was Cured of the Taint and Able to have child. Despite having reduced fertility. The child showed no signs of the Blight/Taint despite literally being conceived when she was Tainted. Showing an interesting thing that a non-tainted being can be born and live inside a Tainted one without any negatives.
Like I said this isn't the destroy option I'm talking about it's the adaptation. That you render non-Tainted beings immune to the Taints negatives. For example when you survive a virus you could grow either an immunity or resistance. In other words the Taint is in fact left alive but so is everything else too.
Who's to say the Maker actually exists that's another argument entirely. But regardless that doesn't mean Humanity can't go against the will of God especially when he's corrupt, Nor does it mean that God will always seek to punish Humanity for all we know in the future there could come a time when even he's had enough and clearly sees such a divine punishment doesn't work. For example people have simply because more and more bitter and extremist rather than guilt-ridden and humble. Also they've effectively countered the Blights FIVE times each one lasting less than half the time it took to defeat the last. The Blights are failures if it's a punishment on Humanity let alone the fact it targets the other races too meaning this "Maker did it" theory is unsupported in every way from the beginning notion.
"he's telling us his version of the truth"
Was literally me already acknowledging that. You don't believe him out of fear. I do believe him out of goodwill/trust. Neither of us have been proven right in the slightest either the consequences of his death or survival haven't affected the world yet.
It can be done if Corypheus the obviously more powerful of the two can be. Fuck these aren't even the most powerful beings in existence. There's Solas, Evanuris, Forgotten Ones, Old Gods, Titans Pure or Corrupted...We're going to have to fight literal GODS going forward...Not even wannabes like Corpy or Haakon the real thing. If the Maker's Evil will have to face and fight him too. The Architect is simple in comparison. Yes this is all an assumption/theory but come on this is the very thing Inquisition was hinting at will be going down later on. Let alone Armies of the Qunari, Legions of Tevinter Magisters, Aldrich Abominations left and right coming from places like Hormak.
Plus who knows what powers and abilities or crew of Hardened Killers are New Protagonist will have. We could end up being God level powerful ourselves. Or just get lucky. Or skilled.
If the Blights and Corypheus can be defeated. So can the Architect if he's actually a bad guy.
You think it's misguided once again given there's no actual consequences to either decision you're only speculating based on your preconceived notions. Ones that I disagree with.
What do you think?